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BDYETP 84: Princess Bride, Barry’s BBQ, Haggis “recapitalizes,” baby games revisited, JJP Pirates Review

Bro, Do you Even Talk Pinball·podcast_episode·2h 11m·analyzed·Mar 10, 2024
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.039

TL;DR

Pin Brew Fest preview, Princess Bride praised, Barry's BBQ roasted for lazy design.

Summary

Episode discusses Pin Brew Fest 2024 (April 4-6 in Girard, Ohio) featuring 100+ pinball games, new releases, tournaments, and charity fundraising. Reviews Princess Bride by Multimorphic as an immersive P3 game with full movie assets and creative theming. Heavily criticizes Barry O's Barbecue Challenge by American Pinball for lazy artwork (stock photos/footage), poor aesthetic cohesion, and minimal mechanical depth—calling it a low-effort release using placeholder assets.

Key Claims

  • Princess Bride is the first P3 game to integrate full motion video of actors into pinball gameplay

    high confidence · Kevin discusses hands-on experience with Princess Bride reveal stream; describes video integration as 'the first time we're seeing full motion video of actors on their play field screen'

  • Princess Bride reveal stream reached 370,000 unique viewers over two hours, exceeding Willy Wonka stream performance

    high confidence · Kevin states: 'we hit a stream high, more than 370,000 unique viewers over the course of the two hours we were streaming this. That part topped the Willy Wonka stream.'

  • Barry O's Barbecue Challenge uses stock footage and iStock photos rather than original artwork

    high confidence · Nick: 'Somebody found the actual, like, stock footage... They went to – Oh, my God. They literally did go to, like, iSockphoto or one of those – Oh, my God. – and got clips of stuff being barbecued and just dropped it in there.'

  • Pin Brew Fest 2024 will feature 100+ games with commitments from Stern (30-40 games including 10 Jaws LEs), Spooky, and American Pinball

    high confidence · Keith: 'This year we've already got commitments to have over 100 games before we even start and ask other people to bring stuff. We have a new rep coming in from Stern. They're bringing in, let's see, 30, 40 games. Ten of them are going to be Jaws and all limited editions'

  • Mark Ritchie is returning to Pin Brew Fest as a guest because it's his favorite show

    high confidence · Keith: 'Mark Ritchie's coming back. Turns out this is his favorite show. He likes the beer.'

  • Barry O passed away in 2022

    high confidence · Nick: 'Barry O passed away in 2022. I want to – when we talk about this game, I mean, they slapped Barry O's name on it, not just his likeness, but his name on it.'

  • Princess Bride pricing: kit-only $3,750 (standard) to $5,000 (LE); full machine $11,500-$13,750 depending on tier

    high confidence · Kevin provides detailed pricing breakdown for Multimorphic Princess Bride at reveal

Notable Quotes

  • “We finally get a barbecue-themed game. Cannot wait to talk about that one.”

    Kevin Manning @ Opening — Sets up the episode's central theme and anticipation for Barry's BBQ reveal

  • “It looks like they went to iStockphoto in search for a pile of chopped wood, found a high-resolution image, and just dropped it on the front of his cabinet.”

    Kevin Manning @ Barry's BBQ discussion — Encapsulates the criticism of lazy, uninspired artwork design on Barbecue Challenge

  • “This is such a low effort. It is so bad.”

    Nick Lane @ Barry's BBQ artwork critique — Direct harsh criticism of the overall production quality and aesthetic decisions

  • “The game is probably the most immersive of the P3 games. It's the first time they've taken, like, full movie assets and been able to integrate it into a pinball machine.”

    Kevin Manning @ Princess Bride discussion — Highlights technical achievement and thematic integration as a standout feature

  • “One of the things that is particularly interesting in use is the P3 features is the one-handed mode... they switch over and play it halfway through the right. Really cool theme integration.”

    Kevin Manning @ Princess Bride mechanics — Demonstrates creative use of P3 platform mechanics tied to movie storyline

  • “If you want to go play all the new games and not wait in line for hours, Pembroke is an amazing opportunity to do that.”

    Kevin Manning @ Pin Brew promotion — Positions Pin Brew as alternative venue to avoid lengthy queues at larger expos

  • “They literally did go to, like, iStockphoto or one of those – and got clips of stuff being barbecued and just dropped it in there.”

    Nick Lane @ Barry's BBQ critique — Confirms use of stock footage rather than original production, emphasizing cost-cutting approach

  • “I have no positive, negative, strong feelings on Barry O. I've played many of his games and like it. But this is The theme that they're rolling with.”

Entities

Pin Brew FesteventKeithpersonPrincess BridegameMultimorphiccompanyBarry O's Barbecue ChallengegameAmerican Pinball

Signals

  • ?

    business_signal: American Pinball's Barry O release demonstrates minimal marketing investment (no official trailer) and incomplete product launch information compared to industry standards

    high · Nick: 'American Pinball has not given us a trailer to really look at. This is a very bizarre launch, to say the least.'

  • ?

    community_signal: Princess Bride reveal stream reached 370,000 unique viewers on Twitch front page, exceeding Willy Wonka stream performance; demonstrates significant community interest in licensed P3 games

    high · Kevin: 'we hit a stream high, more than 370,000 unique viewers over the course of the two hours we were streaming this. That part topped the Willy Wonka stream.'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Pinball community enthusiasm for Princess Bride extremely high (reflected in record stream viewership); conversely, substantial skepticism and criticism toward Barry O's Barbecue Challenge regarding effort and artistic execution

    high · 370k viewers vs typical release attention; hosts unable to identify positive aspects of Barry's BBQ beyond basic availability

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Barry O's Barbecue Challenge criticized for relying on stock photography (coin door wood pile) and stock footage (cooking turkey legs) rather than original artwork, indicating minimal production investment

    high · Nick: 'They literally did go to, like, iStockphoto or one of those – and got clips of stuff being barbecued and just dropped it in there'; Kevin: 'looks like they went to iStockphoto in search for a pile of chopped wood, found a high-resolution image, and just dropped it on the front'

  • ?

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.396

0:00
All right, coming up on this episode of Bro, Do You Even Talk Pinball, we've got what everybody's been waiting for. After more than 50 years of pinball, we finally get a barbecue-themed game. Cannot wait to talk about that one. We also got Keith from Pin Brew. We've got the Princess Bride. We're going to review our first Jersey Jack game ever on the podcast. All that and more coming right up. Double Super Jack Podcast!
0:30
I need a ramp. I need a roof. I want a car if I can get. I need a school. I need a double. I've got my wife.
0:52
That's right. And now, the Hall and Oates of Pinball Podcasting, Nick Lane and Kevin Manning of Buffalo Pinball. Whoa, boom shakalaka. Boom shakalaka. Nick, you're muted. We need you to come back. I'm good. There you are. Yeah. I know where that mute button is. What's going on, everybody? Welcome to the March 2024 episode of Birdies and Talk Pinball. I'm Kevin. That's Nick. What's going on? There's Keith. And then Keith. This has become an annual tradition, and I look forward to it because when Keith comes on and we're talking about pin brew, that means that the weather is going to get better and I can finally take some time off and go and play some pinball. So let's kick this off. Let's start off with pin brew, and Keith is here to tell us all about it. So, Keith, you've got to become an expert at this point in talking about pin brew. What's the overview for somebody who might just be tuning in and might not know? Well, I'm just impressed that I got ahead of barbecue. I figured that was the big news of the year here. But now Pembroke's coming up, number four. We're pretty excited. It's growing every year. This year we've already got commitments to have over 100 games before we even start and ask other people to bring stuff.
2:16

  • Barry O's Barbecue Challenge priced at $7,000 (standard) or $8,500 (LE limited to 100 units)

    high confidence · Nick: 'The pricing is $7,000 for a standard or $8,500 for the LE, which is limited to $100, which may be ambitious.'

    • Nick Lane @ Barry's BBQ context — Establishes separation between critique of game design and respect for Barry Oursler's legacy

    company
    Barry Ourslerperson
    Kevin Manningperson
    Nick Laneperson
    Bro, Do You Even Talk Pinballorganization
    Past Times Arcadeevent/venue
    Stephen Silverperson
    T.J. Weaverperson
    Matt Andrewsperson
    Mark Ritchieperson
    Stern Pinballcompany
    Spooky Pinballcompany
    Jawsgame
    Labyrinthgame
    Allie's Armsorganization
    Flippin' Out Pinballcompany
    Paul Ferrerperson
    Tommy Veseyperson

    design_philosophy: Multimorphic's design approach for Princess Bride emphasizes creative use of P3 platform features in service of thematic integration; mechanical design supports movie narrative (sword fight mode, Cliffs mechanic)

    high · Kevin's detailed breakdown of one-handed mode mechanics and lower-playfield side-target usage reflecting narrative elements

  • ?

    event_signal: Pin Brew Fest 2024 (April 4-6, Girard, Ohio) positioned as major showcase event with 100+ games, multiple manufacturer participation, and significant tournament infrastructure

    high · Keith provides detailed event overview with confirmed commitments from Stern (30-40 games), Spooky, American Pinball; Tommy Vesey organizing tournaments; $110 VIP tickets with exclusive perks

  • ?

    licensing_signal: American Pinball secured rights to use Barry Oursler's name and likeness for Barbecue Challenge post-mortem (Oursler died 2022), raising questions about IP management and game naming decisions

    high · Nick emphasizes: 'Barry O passed away in 2022... they slapped Barry O's name on it, not just his likeness, but his name on it'

  • $

    market_signal: Barry O's Barbecue Challenge LE limited to 100 units at $8,500; positioning suggests American Pinball attempting collector scarcity strategy despite concerns about production viability

    medium · Nick: 'The pricing is $7,000 for a standard or $8,500 for the LE, which is limited to $100, which may be ambitious' (transcript shows '100' but context suggests typo for '100 units')

  • ?

    community_signal: Mark Ritchie identified as returning guest to Pin Brew Fest 2024; states it is his favorite show, indicating strong designer endorsement of event quality

    high · Keith: 'Mark Ritchie's coming back. Turns out this is his favorite show. He likes the beer.'

  • ?

    announcement: Barry O's Barbecue Challenge officially released by American Pinball at $7,000/$8,500 pricing

    high · Nick discusses game reveal on Friday; shows gameplay footage and cabinet artwork; confirms limited LE production (100 units)

  • ?

    announcement: Princess Bride officially revealed as Multimorphic P3 game with full movie asset integration; ships summer 2024

    high · Kevin provides hands-on review from official reveal stream (February 20, 2024); detailed pricing and design credits; confirmed availability at multimorphic.com

  • ?

    product_strategy: Princess Bride represents technical advancement for P3 platform with first implementation of full motion video of actors integrated into playfield screen; creative theme-specific mechanics like one-handed sword fight mode

    high · Kevin: 'The game is probably the most immersive of the P3 games. It's the first time they've taken, like, full movie assets and been able to integrate it into a pinball machine.'

    • We have a new rep coming in from Stern. They're bringing in, let's see, 30, 40 games. Ten of them are going to be Jaws and all limited editions of all the other pieces. So we're excited about that. Spooky Pinball is being represented this year. We will have a barbecue at the show, and we will have a couple barbecue pinballs at the show. American has reached out to us and made sure that we were going to have some games there. So we're pretty lucky being right after Texas. And Bruce just three days of pinball, pinball tournaments, pinball vendors, beer from eight different craft breweries, and all kinds of food.
    2:58
    That's awesome. I mean, last year was a blast. That was the first time I got to go. Kevin won as well.
    3:05
    Bruce is really happy with the amount of games that were available to play. I mean, a personal highlight for me was playing Pulp Fiction. There's a nice representation from Stern, which it sounds like this is going to be even bigger, which is amazing. And then the tournament was well run as well. So I'm looking forward to coming back. I guess one question that springs to mind is that, first of all, I'm excited that we're going to have the barbecue game there. I'm sure everybody is. And you said there's two of them. Do you think that's enough, Keith? I mean, how long are these lines going to be to play that game, do you think? Well, we're probably going to have to set up in our own lines for these games because I'm sure people are going to be just standing behind each other waiting hours to, you know, make a little, I think it was sweet sauce on the barbecue or something, bumpers. Yeah, I'm not sure how that's going to do, but we will have a lot of other games for those of you who can't wait to play barbecue. Yeah, my recommendation would be get there Thursday. So it goes Thursday through Saturday. A lot of people come Friday, but Thursday is a good sweet spot if you want to play all the new games and not have to fight the lines. Highly recommend doing that.
    4:08
    Agreed. Keith, what am I missing? What else? I mean, this is a slam dunk of a venue to go to. I think it's kind of a good location. It's not too far from Buffalo. It's only like three hours. I think Pittsburgh's in striking distance. Where do you see most people coming from? I mean, we're kind of in between everything there. What you said, Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Cincinnati. We get people coming in from Chicago. Chicago is about a five-hour trek, but Pittsburgh's an hour away. Cleveland's an hour away. So we kind of get that general, that vicinity coming in.
    4:44
    But we're starting to see a lot of people are telling me they're coming in from different states. Somebody posted the other day they're coming in from Washington. So the show's growing. It's got a good reputation. We're really happy about it. One of the exciting things this year is when we do the beer portion, the proceeds of the beer go to a charity. Usually it's a children's charity. And this year it kind of hits home a little bit. We had a good friend of ours in the Columbus market who just lost his daughter. She was 16 to cancer. And he is a big pinball player. And we are using her charity, Allie's Arms, this year for the proceeds of the beer. And we are also having a silent auction. We've already gotten two pinball machines donated for the silent auction. So that ought to be a pretty good twist this year to it. Yeah, that's an amazing gesture and yet another reason to head over to this event and support it. I understand you have VIP tickets. Can you talk a little bit about what you get for that?
    5:47
    So VIP tickets are limited, and we are getting close to the limit. The VIPs close down on the 15th. So if anybody wants one of those tickets, they're $110. and with the VIP ticket you get t-shirt, posters, swag you get a pint glass similar to what you have there a little different design this year which I think you'll like and that pint glass allows you a 16 ounce pour at the beer tent instead of a 12 ounce pour so the glass itself is just a great add-on and on top of all of that everybody that has come to the show in the past Last year we were exclusive with Past Times Arcade, which is Rockburg's huge venue right here in Girard. And this year any of the VIPs can go to Past Times all three days, no charge.
    6:44
    Well, I forgot about that, and that's another huge reason to consider getting the VIP tickets. Seeing Past Times, I mean, again, that's in striking distance. How far away is it from the venue, maybe like 20 minutes? No, it's two miles. It's two miles. Okay, there you go. Literally five minutes down the road. Yeah, no, this has become such a great show to go to, and it's amazing that it's getting better every year. Before we conclude, anything else that I didn't ask or people should know?
    7:14
    No, I think everybody that's been to the show knows what to expect. We're excited. I understand, and you guys know that I'm not a tournament guy, but apparently the tournament's gotten really big, and we're going to get a lot of points this year, I guess. Tommy Vesey's flying in from the West Coast to run the show, run the tournaments. And you tournament guys will be excited about that. I'm happy for you. I have no idea why. No, it was a good tournament last year, for sure. And that's certainly important to me in one of these shows. So anybody who is a tournament player listening to this, I'm happy to endorse the tournament at this event. So I'm looking forward to this year. All right, awesome. He thinks so much for coming on. Last piece I wanted to let you know, Mark Ritchie's coming back. Turns out this is his favorite show. He likes the beer. So we've invited him to come back this year. Obviously, Pulp Fiction's going to be here in numbers. And look forward to seeing you guys at the show. Look forward to seeing you as well. I'll just give my plug for Pin Brew because last year was my first time going.
    8:20
    Last year was crazy because we had all of those new games come out at once, and they were all at Pin Brew. and you saw the pictures from the bigger shows like Texas Pinball Festival where people were waiting hours to play the new games. We got to go and play at Pembroke. I don't want to give away our secret because the secret is going to be out and then the show is going to get loaded. But if you want to go play all the new games and not wait in line for hours, Pembroke is an amazing opportunity to do that. And you're going to have a Princess Bride there too, right? We are. Yeah. So Princess Bride and barbecue and Jaws and, like, all the new stuff. You're going to be able to check it out there and not wait a whole bunch of times. That's great. The new Spookies will be there, too. Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Looney Tunes. Nice. So we have a good representation again this year. We're pretty happy. Yeah. How about Labyrinth before I forget? Labyrinth will be there also, yes. Amazing. Okay. Everything you'd want to play. There we go. Boom.
    9:17
    All right. So, yeah, check it out. where should they go if they want to learn more and get tickets? To get tickets or learn more about the show, it is pinbrewfest.com.
    9:30
    All right. Go check it out and everybody have a good time. Remind everybody what the dates and the location are again. It is April 4th, 5th, and 6th, Thursday 4 to 11, Friday and Saturday, 10 to midnight.
    9:44
    VIPs get in an hour early, all days. Sounds good. And Girard, Ohio is the location? Girard, Ohio. All right. Sounds good. Thanks, Keith. Enjoy the rest of your weekend as you get ready for Pin Brew. Have a great show.
    9:57
    Thanks. Take care. Next year, will you thank some partners? Let's thank some partners. All right. Do the honors for us.
    10:05
    All right. We're going to start off with both of our premier partners. That is Pinstadium Lights. Go to pinstadium.com. You can buy some lighting kits for your pinball machine controlled by iOS or Android. countless colors that you can change it to. They've got the new lower profile Pins Stadium Neo Adams. Highly recommend. Always innovating on that title. That's pinsstadium.com. Use coupon code Buffalo, by the way. Save 10%. That's a good chunk of change you're going to save by using that trick. And then Flippin' Out Pinball, flippinoutpinball.com. If you're one of the many, many, many people that are looking to buy Barry O's Barbecue Challenge, head over to FlippinOutPinball.com. If for some crazy reason you want that game and you want one of the other games, well, you can also buy them from Zach as well. He'll take care of you. Best service in the industry. That's FlippinOutPinball.com. And then shout out to our other partners, as always, Comet Pinball for LEDs, Titan Pinball for silicone rings, but also many, many more things like balls and also the comfortable mat. We've got a new sponsor. This is one I reached out to specifically because I am a big fan of this product and that is playfieldprotectors.com. The way you type this in is playfield-protectors.com. You know, I'm at this age, I have to ask if that's a dash. Playfield-protectors.com, or you can just Google it for pinball and it will come up. Frank will take care of you.
    11:35
    I'm going to spend a moment on this one just because it's a new sponsor. Maybe some people aren't aware. If you've got a classic game, they don't have clear code on it, okay, and art on older games is something special.
    11:51
    And certainly one way to protect it that I recommend is to head on over to Playfield Protectors. It is a clear, I don't know what it's made out of. This is how bad I am, but I don't know what it's made out of. I've had some of these on my game for years now.
    12:08
    It's easy enough to put on. You don't have to take apart usually the entire playfield. It's cut right. And another benefit of not just protecting the art is the fact that on these older games, over time, the inserts get cupped. So usually it's concave. And what that means is that the ball doesn't run true to how the game was when it was made. It's going over kind of these little valleys. Well, with a playfield protector, that thing is going to be perfectly flat and smooth. So the game is going to play way more like it was when it was first made. Check it out. Again, Playfield Protectors, playfield-protectors.com. All right, and then last but not least, Kevin, we've got Waltzimorphic, which Kevin's going to talk more about. He was just doing a stream last week. And then Pinside.com, Pinside.com to talk about pinballs, buy and sell, great marketplace. All right, let's get the show going. All right, let's hype our giveaway first. That's right, that's right. We've got a giveaway, a $50 gift card to everybody's favorite place to get silicone rings, Titan Pinball. Nick talked about them a little bit. If you go to titanpinball.com, you can use this gift card if you want and get yourself a whole bunch of cool stuff like their sweet pin mats. They got the silicone rings, LED lights, magnetic nut drivers if you're working on your game, pinballs. That's where Nick and I both buy the balls for our pinball machines. It's important to make the differentiation there. So, yeah, if you're in chat, in the Twitch chat, type hashtag win, and that'll get you in. We'll pick a winner at the end of the show.
    13:48
    My bot doesn't work in the YouTube chat, so you've got to be in Twitch chat for that. Hashtag win. Thanks for watching. Thanks for the giveaway from Titan Pinball. And, by the way, use coupon code Buffalo there when you put your order in. You'll save 10%. There's some things that it doesn't apply to. Yeah, it's for the silicone rings. So if you're getting the rings, the competition rings, get those. Save yourself some money. I've got to order new rings today, too. Oh, there you go. All right. Let's have our friend introduce us into the news. Here's the tip. It's the latest pinball news. Show hunt. It's on fire. All right. Topping off the news, we had two new pinball machines revealed. This was the, I don't know, it's the better of the two. I haven't played the other one yet, but I played this one. It's called the Princess Bride. It's from Multimorphic. I joined the crew down in Austin, Texas to play their game on the reveal stream. This came out February 20th, 2024. This is pricing on the Princess Bride. So pricing for multi-morphic games are a little more complicated than your traditional pinball machines. But if you want your game kit only, the standard is $37.50. The LE is $5,000. if you want a full machine with the princess bride included uh it's 11.5 for the standard 12.750 for the le or 13.750 for the collector's edition and the collector's edition is it's a brand new um level for for this they've never done a collector's edition uh before and it's pretty cool it's this if you're like a diehard princess bride fan and this is your favorite movie of all time and you absolutely want to have this in your lineup as like you know a shining beacon in your lineup It comes with a topper and the sword art, the armor that's powder-coated,
    15:36
    decals, or the art all over it. A new feature they started adding is the art on the front of the machines, which looks really nice. But this is a game design by, so Multimorphic has, like, a team approach when it comes to game design. So on game design listed are Colin McAlpine, Jerry Stellenberg, Josh Kugler, Roy Cernuta, Stephen Silver, Steve Scheuer, and T.J. Weaver. Stephen Silver was the creative director, so he's kind of the one who oversaw the project. He was the lead on the project. And then mechanics were by T.J. Weaver and Trey Jones. Software by Greg Goldie, Josh Kugler, Michael Ocean, and Steve Scheuer. Artwork by Matt Andrews. You might remember him from Weird Al's Museum of Natural Hilarity or Total Nuclear Annihilation. sound by Matt Kern and music by Paul Ferrer and Mark Knopfler. You might know him from the band Dire Straits. He's one of the original artists on the Princess Bride theme song. So, yeah, if you haven't seen it yet, we did a reveal stream on this, but the game, I can give some first impressions because I actually had hands on with it. The game is probably the most immersive of the P3 games. It's the first time they've taken, like, full movie assets and been able to integrate it into a pinball machine. You know, we've seen other themes, like Weird Al, and there was video assets with that. They used some of their – they used, like, the Mission Statement song. They had the video from that, but it was an animated video. So this is the first time we're seeing full motion video of actors on their play field screen, which is really cool. I was always kind of wondering how they would integrate it. And I can show, while I'm talking, I can show you some of the footage here of the stream.
    17:26
    You can see how the artwork is integrated in a little, like, inset kind of, like, pop-up display when it shows the video clips. Above this really cool map that Matt Andrews drew, which is kind of like the base artwork for the play field. And then you've also got the book at the bottom that kind of flips through and shows you your mode progress and things like that. in addition to the shot counters that you – or shot indicators that you have up at the top of the screen, which is kind of a standard when it comes to multi-market games. So really great integration of the theme. They got all the assets from the movie. So if you love the movie and you wanted to see everything in there, everything's in there.
    18:07
    What else? You know, call-outs are all movie call-outs. The layout is really neat. It's got the cool mech where you climb the Cliffs of Insanity on the upper right. When I saw the first pictures of this game, I was looking at that part, and I'm like, man, I wonder if the ball actually goes up there, and it does. Yeah, if you hit it past that drop target, a magnet grabs and holds the ball, and as you hit either of the two ramp shots, it slowly climbs up the cliffs, and once you get to the top of the cliffs, it holds the ball, and you can pick a mode and then you can move on and move into one of your, I think it was three modes on that shot.
    18:47
    A really super fun game. I can't wait to get mine. Is there anything else specifically I want to talk about? Yeah, the theme integration is amazing. So one of the things that is particularly interesting in use is the P3 features is the one-handed mode. So if you're familiar with the movie and when they get to the sword fight, they both start out using their left hands because they don't want the sword fight to be over too quickly, blah, blah, blah. And then halfway through they switch over and they use their right hand. They're like, you know, they revealed it. I'm right-handed, so am I, and then they switch over. So the mode, you start playing with two buttons on the left, and then once you make it halfway through the mode, you switch over and play it halfway through the right. Really cool theme integration. The other one that I liked was the one where you're using the side targets to find my sword shot left and right on the scoops. I thought that was a really clever use of the lower section of the playfield. One of the common remarks about the P3 is like, oh, there's nothing to shoot on the lower two-thirds of the playfield. Well, that mode specifically uses the lower two-thirds in a very creative way where it forces you to shoot the side targets to move the shot where you need it to be and then cash it out. So really clever creative uses of all the P3s features.
    20:17
    Again, great license here. It hits that nostalgic 80s vibe. And, yeah, it's great to see that they got full assets and were able to integrate this in such a cool way. I can't wait to get mine. I think we're able to catch any of the stream or any of that. Yeah, you did a great job. I think they did a really good job of just, as you said, integrating the theme, right? It looks interesting to me. It's nice to see that P3 keeps on getting better and better. And, again, it's like themes, right? Like you get a theme, make a theme, do a licensed theme, that works. By the way, like this is coincidental, Kevin. I was scrolling through Facebook while you were talking because I'm just FADD. and there was an ad. I'm not kidding.
    21:02
    I'm in like a 4K movie deals and pre-orders thing and The Princess Bride is on Amazon right now. The Criterion Collection, for only $26, it's 47% off. So there you go. Yeah, I just picked that up. Before I went to play the game, I was like, I need to watch the movie again. I was like, wow, this is a perfect excuse to spend a bunch of money on a 4K version of it. So I upgraded to 4K. Logan and I watched it. We had a blast. and if you've never seen the movie highly recommended it kind of starts off I remember being skeptical of it I saw it when I was a kid and I was like Princess Bride is this like a girl movie or what's going on here but it starts off it's like it's a grandfather telling his son this story and when he's sick in bed the kid's like probably 10 years old and he's like it looks like a kissing book and blah blah blah and it ends up being This is just like incredibly quotable and like a super hilarious movie. At work, you know, I do public relations for work, and we started calling.
    22:08
    A lot of times we'll, like, review content for other areas of the school that I work for. And when people start their letters with, hello, my name is, hi, like, hi, I'm Kevin Manning, and I want to blah, blah, blah. We call those the Inigo Montoya letters now. I'm like, it's like Inigo Montoya. And he says, hello, my name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die. So who knew when this movie came out that it would end up being so quotable and so meme-worthy all this, you know, 30 years later or whatever after it came out. So really cool. Can't wait to try it. And, yeah, like Nick said, it was a personal highlight for us in the Twitch channel. We were on the front page of Twitch, and we hit a stream high, more than 370,000 unique viewers over the course of the two hours we were streaming this.
    23:00
    That part topped the Willy Wonka stream. We didn't hit that many unique viewers for Wonka, and we were around 14,000 concurrent viewers, which is a little less than Wonka. So it was right up there with some of the biggest streams we've ever done.
    23:15
    Super excited. anytime we get a chance to do that, and Nick and I were talking about this, anytime we can advance pinball, bring pinball to more people, get it in front of more folks on the front page of Twitch, being a partner, you have opportunities to do that every once in a while. Super happy to get pinball in front of that many people, and specifically a new game with a cool license like The Princess Bride.
    23:38
    And if you missed it live, it's on YouTube. That's where I was showing some of the footage from before. You can check that out. And, you know, They start shipping this summer. They're available at multimorphic.com if you want to grab one for yourself. Okay.
    23:52
    Nick, do you want to talk about barbecue pinball? Oh, it's that time already? I mean, it's big news. It's the second machine that we saw revealed this month. Oh, God. Do you want to kick it off? I had to apologize to Keith because I forgot that we were, like, I think I was trying to keep the link. We've got him coming on the show at 11 this morning. And I messaged Kevin. I was like, dude, ever since this game dropped on Friday, that's all I've been thinking about.
    24:26
    So, and I don't know what to even, I do know what to think, but I don't even know how to organize my thoughts on it, and I don't even know where to begin. All right. Well, let me kick it off with the praising and everything. Thank you, Kevin. All right. We'll get some structure. What is the game? What is the game called? So American Pinball has revealed Barry O's Barbecue Challenge Hot Sauce and Hot Rods, the theme everybody's been clamoring for. It's a – let's see. The pricing is $7,000 for a standard or $8,500 for the LE, which is limited to $100, which may be ambitious. We'll get into more of that later.
    25:09
    So let's show over here. I don't know where to start. So, okay. Let's jump over here. We've never had this problem on this podcast of where to begin with this. Why don't you show the game? Okay. Why don't we just talk about the objective things, right? The facts about the game as presented thus far. Show the game. Who is Barry O?
    25:38
    What is the game? What does it look like? And then we can go into, we can work through this together. Okay, so who's Berrio, Nick? For folks at home who may not know, who's Berrio? So Berrio is a pinball designer. I mean, he's not like a Steve Ritchie-level pinball designer. He's not a Keith Elwin. But he's a pinball designer who's made definitely some good games. The ones that come to mind are Bram Stoker's Dracula. I've got a Jungle Lord from him. I believe he made that. Those are the ones off the top. Honestly, those are the ones off the top of my head where I think of Barry Osler. and that's kind of it. One of the most notable ones was Space Shuttle, right? That was the one in the 80s where folks were like, oh, it brought Pinball back in the middle of the video game revolution and all that. So he's had some notable – Pinbot, he contributed to Pinbot too, right? Yeah, All Anonymous says Bride of Pinbot. So, you know, we've got to dive back like 30, 40 years to get to Barry Owser, but okay. Right. No, he made some classic well-known games, And if you're into pinball the way you're listening to a pinball podcast, I'm sure you've played those games and you're familiar with those games, and they're solid games for sure. Yeah, his most recently released game, I guess, was technically Queen by Pinball Brothers. So that was like his final game.
    26:58
    Oh, okay. I think that technically was his last full design. Anyway, so that's who Berrio is. And I want to just be very – so Barry O passed away in 2022. I want to – when we talk about this game, I mean, they slapped Barry O's name on it, not just his likeness, but his name on it.
    27:18
    Be very clear that we're distinguishing between Barry and any comments or criticism about this game, all right? Like, this is how American Pinball decided to roll with it.
    27:30
    Just keep that in mind. This is no – I have no positive, negative, strong feelings on Barry O. I've played many of his games and like it But this is The theme that they're rolling with Let me just put that out there before we proceed with this conversation That's right, nothing personal against Barry O Alright, so that's Barry O So let's Talk us through what we're seeing here As far as the theme of the game And the layout of the Pinball machine and all that We got a comment that this thing just dropped On Friday and we got some lack of pictures of the game, like kind of the typical shot of a pinball machine that you'd see on a flyer, and the layout is kind of it. We haven't seen American Pinball has not given us a trailer to really look at. This is a very bizarre launch, to say the least.
    28:24
    So on the back glass is Barry. He's in a hot rod. He's got, I guess, some hot sauce in his hand, and he's, I can't even tell from the picture, he's, like, dragging his, like, smoker or something. I don't know. I mean, I like barbecue, but I don't live and die by barbecue. The cabinet has some pretty terrible artwork on it, I would say. Like, the front where the coin door is is, like, wood. Like, wood just, like, I understand that you need wood for the smoker, but, okay. Yeah. It looks like they went to iStockphoto in search for a pile of chopped wood, found a high-resolution image, and just dropped it on the front of his cabinet. Well said, Kevin. Well said. It's not even like an artist drew that and made it look nice or interesting. It looks very fucking lazy, to say the least, and it doesn't aesthetically look good. If you think that looks good in your lineup, not that most people are looking at the art on the coin door, but it does matter.
    29:22
    The art is very important to them. The back glass art is fine. I think it's kind of got that Williams-esque fun era attitude to it. It's fine. It's got a pig is driving the car, so if you're into animals driving vehicles and stuff like that, then you're going to love it. Yeah, but the issue with it, it's like not a cohesive art package, right? Like, this is cool. It'd be nice if the rest of the cabinet looked like this, right? Right. It's not cohesive. So the front shouldn't be like this real, like, image of logs. It should flow with that, right? and the side of the cabin doesn't flow with that. So they did a good job with the trans light, and the rest just looks lazy. And the speaker panel that is like a top-down view of charcoal with a grate in front of it.
    30:08
    Yeah, I saw some video of like the LCD. I haven't seen much, but it shows like turkey legs being roasted. I mean, I guess that's what you've got to do, but it's not like a cartoony kind of maybe fun what you would expect from Williams. It's just like full motion video of food being cooked. There it is. Turkey legs. Yeah. Wow.
    30:30
    This is such a low effort. It is so bad. Thank you, Kevin. I can't help it. If they at least mimic the art on the trans light and made this kind of colorful and fun, like, okay, we can try to be positive there, but a full motion video of cooking turkey legs.
    30:50
    I thought this was a good idea. I can't. Somebody went off on it. I can imagine the ideas that got rejected. I was looking through this right on Pinzide, and somebody found the actual, like, stock footage. So they didn't even shoot their own footage of barbecuing. They went to – Oh, my God. They literally did go to, like, iSockphoto or one of those – Oh, my God. – and got clips of stuff being barbecued and just dropped it in there.
    31:14
    So there you go. And honestly, there's not much more we can say about this game. And when it was revealed, people were saying that, hey, this looks an awful lot like another game from American Pinballs, which is Hot Wheels in terms of the layout. It's a fan layout. So it's not exactly that, but it's certainly got some of that to it.
    31:37
    I don't know. It's got a few ramps, Kevin, fan layout. Like no toys whatsoever that I'm aware of on this game. Are you? No. It's two big swooping ramps, which are kind of a Barry Osler hallmark. You think about the big sweeping ramp on Doctor Who or Bram Stoker's Dracula. He likes those, so that makes sense to him. I do also like the locks on the sides, which is reminiscent of Space Shuttle. So there are a lot of nods to some of Barry's signature playfield designs, which I like. this video we're showing you is from P-Dub's Arcade Loft if you're watching so shout out to them they got some footage of that game from one of the shows it was at this weekend I watched this video which is nice that he got this and filmed it some of the quotes that he had it's like an EM and it's slow he said don't sell a game for $7,000 old and slow If you skip to about seven minutes and 20 seconds in the video, because he keeps talking about how fun it is, and he was surprised by it, blah, blah, blah. You might be surprised.
    32:50
    But the bottom line is... I'm definitely surprised, Kevin. He gets this seven minutes in and he like this is super fun Would I buy it No And I think that the recurring theme we seeing over and over And I wanted to do a little research Let me so I like all right maybe I wrong Maybe, you know, we always see those threads about people clamoring for original themes. Maybe this is it. You know, it's got, like, I'm seeing throwbacks to stuff like Diner. You know, you can see, you know, maybe this is the theme people have been clamoring for, the original theme. So on Pinzide, one of the common thread types when a new machine comes out is the, are you in or are you out on buying this game? So it's like, I'm going to start one for this theme, and we'll see. Let's get some actual numbers. For context, here's the Foo Fighters, which was a pretty popular game, right? I think kind of inherently most of the time people are going to say no, because there's always going to be more people who aren't buying a game than are buying a game. But you can see percentage-wise where things kind of lay out. So Foo Fighters, a popular Stern title, 60% of people were no thanks.
    34:03
    32% said yes, I'm in. And how many people are 32%? 179 votes? 179 votes. 337 votes for no thanks. And 9% said maybe. That was 50 votes. So you've got over 200 people who are either yes or maybe.
    34:22
    For a more, like, what am I trying to say? A boutique pinball manufacturer. There you go. That's the word I was looking for. From Pinball Brothers, but a good theme. Alien. There was on the main thread here. Are you in or are you out? 62 people said they were buying the limited version. 59 people said they were not interested oh wait this is I'm sorry that explains it 33% said this is split three ways pretty much so 33% said limited 32% said standard and 35% said not interested so that's pretty even and then Godfather which was a more divisive game 7% said they were in on an L.E., some 20% or 60 votes were in on a C.E., and 73%, which is pretty high, 223 votes said they're out. Okay, now that we have that context, let's take a look at Barry O. Are you in?
    35:33
    So this is over, we're getting around 250 votes total for this poll. 7%, 18 people said they're in. 198 people, 82% said they are out, and 26% – or 26 votes, 11% said they are maybe. So, again, and this is a snapshot in time, right? So Nick and I always talk about why you need licensed themes. You need licensed themes because you get people to get their wallets out and buy the game. With an original theme, you're not going to have that instant, give me this game immediately. It's my favorite movie. It's my favorite band. and it's my favorite TV show. I've got to have it right now.
    36:16
    All the comments I'm seeing are saying either I'm out or looks fun, I need to play it first. And even if the people who are saying I need to play it first, they're probably not going to buy it. They're just going to play it at their arcade. If their arcade decides to buy it, then they're going to go home without buying it. Am I wrong, Nick? 100%. You posted this quote in our chat, and I think this sums it up, and I really like this quote. This quote comes from Ron Cameron. It's a post on Pinball Enthusiast. He writes, All right, I rarely complain about games and never before I play them, but who is American Pinball's barbecue pin designed for? He writes, I like American Pinball. I love barbecue. I love Barry Osler designs. I really hate paying more than $7,000 for a new pin. I check all the boxes, and yet this announcement does nothing for me. I hope it sounds like hotcakes and it's an excellent pin, but this one I'll really need to play before I get excited about it. And I hope, hope, hope that American Pinball knows what they're doing. Part of me is very, very afraid of the theme choice. So here is somebody, right? They found the bend diagram. They found somebody who likes American Pinball, which there's not a huge amount of people that like them. There's people that like American Pinball, and they've made games that people like, but it's not like a Stern or Jack. So you've got somebody who likes it. You got somebody who likes Alzer. I mean, most people like barbecue, but this guy loves it.
    37:41
    The price point, and yet it's still a swing and a miss for, like, your target customer. Yeah. Like, even people, there's some people on Pinside who don't know Barry O. Or, like, on Pinball Enthusiasts, they're like, who is Barry O? Like, is he some barbecue guy? Like, what's going on?
    37:59
    My business owner, one of my business partners messaged me on Friday. He's like, I found our next new game for our route, and he shows me this game, and he was joking, right? He's making fun of it. Like, it's a joke, right? Like, it's just why on earth? It doesn't appeal to casuals. You're going to think, like, as you said, Kevin, like, who's Barry O.? Like, is that a Food Network star? That's another thing my business partner mentions. Is it a Food Network star? Like, who the hell is Barry O.? It's just beyond bizarre, and you're going to put out a game with no toys. Now, look, we've talked before where I think that there is a market for, like, you know, early solid state games, right? Like a Fathom-esque game, like we saw Beatles do well. This one has ramps, so it's more of us like an 80s, 90s game, right, but without the toys that people look for, which certainly helps bring down the cost. But I don't know, man. We really ragged on GTF, and we're just like, what the fuck is this? and then somehow they looked at that they didn't sell many GTS at all I mean that game had to be a commercial failure and then they come out with this an even worse theme and it's like at this point when we talk about it it's like you know if you're kind of like making fun of something and then somebody comes you along and says hey that person actually has some cognitive issues and you're like oh I feel really bad making fun of them this is to the point where I almost feel bad ragging on it because it's just so head scratching and bizarre And again, man, like, how do you have – this game's going to be a failure, 100%. GTF was a big failure.
    39:39
    This is their next game. This is going to be a failure. How many failures can American Pinball have in a row like this?
    39:46
    Like, what deep war chests of money do they keep on making games like this? Is there anybody at the company that says, hey, time out. Why are we making this? Who is this for? What is the market for? Will people want this? Is there any indication that this is going to sell well? Why are we doing this? Sure, and Kevin, you made a good point. Maybe if somebody made a custom tribute game to Barry Owsler, this would have been it. That's like a one and done. It's a custom thing, like custom game. You know how people bring games to the show and they remake a game? Fine. This is not a commercial game that if you're a serious pinball company, you put out and you expect to sell. I saw in the chat, maybe they'll sell to restaurants. Like I saw a post the American Pinball did where they're going to try to sell GTFs to ice cream shops. Are you fucking serious?
    40:38
    That's your business plan? You're trying to sell GTFs to ice cream shops? First of all, I understand that there's ice cream in the store and you've got to get it, but you just look at the game and there's no connection to ice cream off the bat.
    40:50
    And then ice cream shops are the hotbed of pinball? First of all, in the Northeast, they're all closed in the wintertime. They're a seasonal thing. And it's just the decision-making is almost a parody and laughable. When this game was launched, people said to themselves, is this April 1st? I had to check. Are they trolling us? No. No, they're not. This is a serious effort in a game to follow up a game that was a failure. Where did they go from here? You know, you mentioned, Kevin, on our last podcast that, you know, maybe they're going to do Cuphead and maybe they're going to do Power Rangers. Are they? Are they going to be able to hemorrhage money like this and not pay employees? Are people going to lose jobs over this? Like, you're running a pinball company. There's jobs at stake. And this is what you come out with? You're competing against Jaws right now. You're competing against Foo Fighters, Pulp Fiction, Labyrinth. I know I'm missing some, Kev. Princess Bride. Aliens still being sold. Aliens. Yeah. Not to mention the secondary market, the used market, the mobile machines is absolutely crashing right now. So you can get games at good deals where two years ago you really couldn't. There's great deals to be had right now. You're competing against all of that, and this is what you produce.
    42:08
    I just don't know what goes on in that company. I mean, it's hilarious. It's sad. It's confusing. yeah, I don't know how this company can exist anymore. It is very weird, very bizarre, very, very bizarre. Even if this game was fun and good, okay, even if it's fun and good, the theme is going to kill it alone, right? Like Dialed In was a good game, it was a fun game, and it didn't do well because the theme was off-putting to people, period. And Jersey Jack, they tried something in, like, 2016, 2017, okay? I think it was 2016, because the market at the time hadn't had an original theme for a long time. All right? Like, I understand why they didn't, but why they made it, it didn't work. People said, okay, and they moved on and learned from it. And yet, here's American Pinball doubling down. We thought that the theme was going to be food truck, so it's adjacent to that, right? This is worse than Food Truck somehow because it's really puzzling with Barry O's barbecue challenge. The fuck is that? Who is Barry O? Like, to anybody else who's not a super nerd like us, this is very, very puzzling, very weird.
    43:24
    Kev, do you think it is – I don't know if this is planned or incompetence. Is it the reason that we haven't seen a reveal trailer or good footage of this game just because they're trying to just get this out and forget about it and move on at this point? That's a good question. The whole reveal aspect of this has been a little head-scratchy. It's crazy, too, to think how different it has been from Galactic Tank Force. If you remember the build-up to GTF, it was teaser after teaser after teaser. We're going to have all these assets, and we've got all these actors that you've never heard of. Remember all that? Everybody remembers that. It got to the point where we're like, just show us the game already. And they took the total opposite approach with this where they're they just kind of dumped it on the internet pictures showed up on pin's eye the web page came up and then they're like oh yeah these are going to be on location tomorrow and they're going to be at uh conventions and stuff which i like i think that's a cool strategy and they did that with legends of valhalla too where they announced it and then it was playable on location at you know a dozen or so um arcades around the country i think that's awesome give people the chance to get their hands on the game and play it, especially with original themes like that. That's a smart idea.
    44:38
    What's not a smart idea is not having the rest of your media ready to go when this launches, right? You want to have a trailer. You want to have a stream schedule, or at least like a YouTube video showing gameplay. Because not everybody lives within driving distance of these dozen or so arcades or the few shows that it's at this weekend. So you need to have all that other stuff ready to go too. Otherwise, you're going to end up with potato cam footage like you're seeing all over Facebook and YouTube of people just setting up their phone and shooting a little video and you can kind of hear the sound and you can see the light show and you see the ball moving around, but that's it. You don't really get a feel for what the rules are like or what the audio experience is. David Thiel is the audio person on this. Show that off. I've not heard any music or anything yet. The best part of this game is probably the audio and nobody's hearing it. Yeah, David Theo is the John Williams of pinball. He's amazing. That's the best thing it's got going for me. You're absolutely right, Kevin.
    45:40
    My advice to American Pinball is what is the Costanza advice? Whatever your first thought is, do the fucking opposite of it.
    45:49
    You might have a chance of being successful. Two more points I want to make and you can feel free to jump in or add anything else too. One thing I want to point out that has been a little head-scratchy to me, but I'm scratching my head a lot at this if you haven't picked that up. So – You got a rash. Yeah. It's almost scratching. Yeah.
    46:11
    Do yourself a favor and just read the webpage because the marketing copy on this is hilarious. But this paragraph here, they've been getting a lot of kudos for this, which I think aren't necessarily justified. So they position it like, commemorating Barry's legacy, the royalties from Barry O's BDQ Challenge will be directed to his estate, supporting his family, and continuing his impactful contribution to the world of pinball. And I see people taking that and reiterating it in a way that it's not written. And we'll talk more about how people misinterpret things later when we talk about the JJP board set and what I said on the last show. So what they're saying is they're paying royalties to Barry's family because he's not here to get the royalties he would normally get, basically, for selling these games. It's based on his design. And they're literally using his name, image, and likeness as part of this – as a selling point for this machine. So, yes, they should be paying his estate. Just much like the Beatles, you know, John Lennon's estate probably made money from the sale of the Beatles machine. That's how this works. It's not a charity piece. This is a thing that happens when you license things or use someone's name, image, and likeness in a product like this. And they're not saying all proceeds are going to this. They're saying the royalty. So there's this X amount was set aside for royalties. for Barry's family, they're still going to be making money on this. It's not a charity product, okay? Do you agree with my interpretation of that, Nick? Yeah, it was, again, they didn't achieve what they thought they were achieving. A lot of things with American pinball is if you take what they're saying and you don't really think about it, and you roll around and he's like, that's fine, and then you put just half an ounce of thought into it, like you just, your analysis, Kevin. Yeah, it's like, yeah, you're 100% right. Yes, if you're going to use somebody's like image likeness or whatever, like, yes, you would expect to pay them royalties. Yes, of course you would expect to pay Barrier, in this case, his family. So why are you putting that in there? And it also comes across as a little slimy that they're kind of trying to position it like it's a charity thing to you. That's how it reads to me. It's like they're trying to. 100%. Yeah. They're going to need to do everything in their power with this game It's just too bad Honestly, you know I'm sure there's talented people over at American Pinball and it's just too bad that time is being spent on this It's really too bad That's it, right? Yeah, the other thing that the other point I want to make is like I remember you listened to some of the podcasts in the lead up to this too, the whole are they going out of business American pinball thing. And I swear Dave was saying that this was Barry Osler's final design. Do you remember that? This is his last design we're bringing into market.
    49:20
    Yeah, it sounds right. I don't know for sure. And there's some of that going around too, where, oh, this is his final design. But then if you look at the webpage, it actually says contributions from Steve Bowden, Dennis Thorman, Ryan McQuaid, in design assistance played a vital role in defining the game's play field.
    49:43
    So there were a lot of hands in the play field design on here. It's not Barry's final design. You know, maybe he had some sketches, but then you had, you know, like you said, all these other talented people at AP, like Steve Bowden, Dennis Norman, Ryan McQuaid, helping him pitching in and getting it over the finish line. So, yeah, lots of hands in the pot making this product come to market and want everybody to get credit like they deserve. So that's all I got. Anything else on this? No, but I do have some more positive things. I got a live announcement. Okay. Just heard from Scott from Penn Stadium. We're going to also give away a set of Neo X Adams valued at $399.95. sense. So make sure to get those raffles in if you're watching on Twitch. Enter what is it? Exclamation mark win? Hashtag win. Hashtag win. Hashtag win into the chat. And now we're giving a set of Neo X Adams.
    50:43
    There we go. Along with the Titan $50 gift certificate. There you go, folks. $399.95. Sneak attack with a giveaway. Hashtag win in chat. Get in on that. We'll pick the winner at the end of the show. So thanks for hanging out. Thanks to Penn Stadium. All right. What's the next one? Oh, boy. This is another good one. We got all sorts of good stuff for you. I got to find where this is. Okay, here we go.
    51:10
    Haggis Pinball. You remember them. This is kind of like out of nowhere. I was like, we haven't heard from them in a while on the last show. And I didn't have any inside information or anything like that. And then about a week or so after our show, this email came through saying that they need to, quote, recapitalize. I'll just read it to you. Tuck in. It'll be story time with Kevin. I'll read this Haggis update so we get the full context. So it says, Haggis update. I hope this message finds you well. I'm reaching out to share some important updates about Haggis Pinball and the status of your game order. As I'm sure you have heard once or twice before, manufacturing pinball machines is hard. It is a multi-disciplined, multi-faceted endeavor incorporating a wide and varied number of components and skills. Starting this endeavor from my garage in Australia at the onset of a global pandemic has proved to be extremely difficult.
    52:07
    While we have been incredibly proud of the quality of games we have produced and the innovation and creation of an industry that did not exist in this country, our throughput and ability to manufacture games in a timely manner has been our shortcoming. Over the last two and a half years, we have produced three different titles and developed an immense capability setting us up for ongoing future success. Our manufacturing methodology is based on just-in-time and lean principles, which I still believe is the optimum strategy. However, this model has a tight coupling and dependency on supply chain continuity and efficiency. Any interruption to the supply chain, of which we have faced many, have a flow-on effect that decreases our throughput and introduces ongoing delays and backlogs. As we wind down the end of Fathom Revisited production and swing into Centaur Revisited, we have made the decision to adjust our manufacturing methodology to move away from such a tight dependency on the supply chain to support our forecasted throughput better. To support this change, we will need to further slow down our production activities, recapitalize, and refocus our procurement strategies and partner offerings. In the short term, what this will mean for those of you currently waiting on a game from us is that there will be further delays. Of this, I am incredibly sorry. Your patience and support and the broader community's patience and support has been tremendous and incredibly important to me and Haggis Pinball as a whole. We would not be able to do what we do without it, so this makes it even harder for me to deliver this news of further delays. However, I believe that for the ongoing continued success of the company, it is something we need to address now rather than repeat the experiences we have had over the production lifecycle of Fathom Revisited. Just to clarify, we are still manufacturing, boxing, and shipping games. That has not changed. So yes, once again, I will ask for your patience and support while we pivot and refocus to improve the ability to build the highest quality games in the world. Thank you for being part of our journey. We value your trust and support immensely. Kind regards, Damien.
    54:16
    Yeah, so there you go. Nick, do you know what recapitalization is? I don't. I should. I looked it up.
    54:25
    Most people don't know. Okay, so Investopedia. I work for a business school, and when one of our professors is talking about things that I don't understand, this is a place I go to. They're like, oh, what does that mean? Okay, so what is recapitalization? So according to Investopedia, they say, recapitalization is the process of restructuring a company's debt and equity mixture, often to stabilize a company's capital structure. So they say the process mainly involves the exchange of one form of financing for another, such as removing preferred shares from the company's capital structure and replacing them with bonds. Key takeaways, recapitalization is the restructuring of a company's debt and equity ratio. So your purpose is to stabilize a company's capital structure.
    55:09
    And this was kind of the key takeaway for me. Some of the reasons a company may consider recapitalization include a drop in share price, which they wouldn't have because they're not a public company, defend against a hostile takeover or bankruptcy.
    55:24
    So the warning lights are going off for Haggis as far as I'm concerned. they've been taking longer and longer to ship games from the point when they tell people okay your machine is ready to go we need you to pay in full people are sending their money and they're not getting their games for months it was supposed to be like two months I think was the time period they were telling people it would take from full payment to receiving it and it's taken like I swear I saw somebody said it was taking it's been a month or a year and they're still waiting for their game. So it's not looking good. And I would be cautious. If you have money, then in this, good luck to you. Hopefully you can get your money back if there's a deposit you have in. But a lot of times these deposits are not refundable. Although I've been kind of in and out of the haggis thread on Pinside, and folks are saying that according to Australian law, If they don't actually produce products, then you might be able to get your deposit back, something like that. So check into that thread for details. But, I don't know, Nick, any thoughts on this? Yeah, look, the writing's on the wall. You know, it's not looking good. Pinball is hard, especially for these smaller companies. They need to produce hits. They need to produce the games out there. You should never pay for a game that is not complete and ready to, you know. If you're going to buy a game, you should only buy a game where as soon as you send the money, they have the game to send you. That's it. And, you know, people always come into this hobby. Maybe somebody's only been in it for a couple years and they haven't seen some of the nonsense that's happened over the last 10 years. But I cannot stress that enough. We try to help people here.
    57:14
    You know, I honestly stick with Stern, stick with JJP. Spooky also delivers. American Pinball has games that they deliver on too as well. P3 is good.
    57:25
    It seems like the Barrels of Fun is new and still improving, but so far so good. But look, man, if somebody's taking your money and the game is not ready and they're promising you a game in the future, don't give them your money. Simple. Really, really simple. Simple.
    57:42
    Buy products that exist. That's our tagline. The only reason that they're doing it is because they've got a Ponzi set up. They're taking your money to complete projects from other people and then shipping those people, taking your money and shipping other people a game, and it's the greater fool, right? You don't want to be – it's like musical chairs. You don't want to play that game. I promise you, you don't want to play that game. Nice. All right. Thank you, Nick. Let's talk a little JJP.
    58:08
    Where am I going here? Oh, let's start with the board set. Fun. So last month, we talked a little bit about this new IO board that JJP has come out with and is available from places like Pinball Life. and I said we had some inside knowledge I was not making this up that replacing the caps will get you about 70% of 70% there as to the performance improvements what you get from just replacing the whole board let's take a trip over to Pinside where JavaGrind888 said the Brody Even Pinball Podcast is reporting only 70% strength upgrade and changing the caps versus buying the board. Any truth to this? And that is that's not what I said. That's what you heard. I said it gets you 70% as to the overall performance improvements, not just strength upgrade. Okay. It's small but important. It's easy to confuse things, right? Okay. So whatever.
    59:17
    Somebody else says I just turned on the flipper strength on GNR with a cap change for $12 and a little bit of my time and take that value over $399. That's fair.
    59:27
    Somebody else says, did they give a reason or did they just pull that figure out of their ass? And somebody says, oh, well, apparently it's just out of their ass. Well, I did not just pull that out of my ass. I wouldn't go ahead and say I had a source on something if I didn't have a source on something. So our good friend, Scott Denisey, to the rescue, went on, I want to pull up his post here went on record and he gave me the the okay to share that uh the details on this so here's what they changed beyond just replacing the cap so it's not just the cap replacement there are other improvements they made on this board so he said number one larger caps on the hv line which increases the current current availability to coil so that's what everybody's uh doing on their own if you want to just replace your caps go ahead that's cool it's a lot cheaper whatever but there are other improvements on the board. Number two, thicker copper weight in the PCB. You can see that the weight of the copper has increased a bit to reduce resistance in the traces. Two and a half, thicker traces. This is also done to reduce resistance in the circuit. Three, different resistors, values, and wattage. The resistors on the input side of the board have changed, and the new ones can handle more current and heat. This is only speculation, but this was probably done as an upgrade to reduce heat in that area of the board. Someone can confirm this if they have an IR temp gauge and both boards. And number four, miscellaneous trace updates. The ground plane was also changed on this new revision as well. This is just a better design as it reduces any resistance difference in the ground. So there you go. That's all in the Buffalo Pinball Discord. If you want to read it for yourself, make sure I didn't pull it out of my ass. If I did not, I guarantee you it's in there. Go check it out. So my thinking was, for a game like Pirates, it's a valuable game. I wouldn't want to take any chances with it. I would just go ahead and buy the board, and that's what I did. I installed it. It's a pretty easy swap. It's like pulling a board out of your old Allie Williams back box. Got a bunch of connectors. They're all keyed, so you're not going to mistakenly put something on the wrong connector. But I did take pictures of everything when I was taking it out because that's a good practice. plugged everything back in make sure the little usb cable is connected in the upper right that one's easy to miss uh and then i put it in and then i can confirm there's a significant improvement in the flipper power i had to and it it improves power to not just the flippers but to all the coils so i ended up tweaking some of my my coil settings so my auto plunger was was stronger and it was making the ball rattle on the on the way up so i actually decreased the power of my auto plunger um the scoop kick out was okay trying to think what else um the i think the auto plunger was the main problem oh and the the kick out from the trough into the the shooter lane i turned that down too because you only really need that as strong as it needs to be to just plop it in there you don't need it tearing up your your shooter lane so i turned that down a little bit too so um that's that's my my thoughts my hands-on thoughts with it it's been actually ended up Ended up increasing the pitch on my Pirates a little bit too, which is kind of nice. Makes it play a little faster. It's got the snappier flippers. You can still rip the ramps. And I think it's a solid upgrade. If you have a JJP machine from before the Toy Story 4. So starting with Toy Story 4, they have this board in them. So you don't need to do any of the upgrades. If you have an earlier machine and you want to do the upgrade, you can swap the board. There's something different with Wizard of Oz. you can't just swap the board but folks in the thread have been doing the cap upgrade on that so or if you just want to upgrade the caps for a couple bucks go ahead and do that too but I don't want to take any chances those are my thoughts on that so that's you know revisiting a topic from last time so there we go also from JJP they have Guns N' Roses code update in beta because I know a lot of folks have been clamoring for score balancing and that and that's the focus of that code rework. I'm in the J.J.P. beta test, and I've been seeing all the chatter on that, and people have been putting up crazy scores on the songs. I think they just put out this second score balancing update, so more to come on that. According to the Quick Flips newsletter from J.J.P., that is expected to come out in the second quarter of this year. If you're a GNR owner, and I know they sold a ton of those, be on the lookout for that. I know that's something folks were looking for. Okay, so that was my topic revisited from last time. Nick Lane has a topic he wanted to revisit from last time, which is the baby games topic.
    64:10
    Yeah, I, uh, God, I'm not going to spend more than a couple minutes on it. You know, I first of all, shout out to Nudge Magazine for they wrote about this, they picked it up, they liked what we said, and even if they didn't like what they said, if they disagreed with it. I'm guessing Nudge would have put out some interesting thoughts on it and we could have a good discussion about it. And that's one thing I really like is I don't think I'm always right. I mean, I know this is my opinion on things. I always like to hear a good representation of the other side. However, after we clipped that segment and put it up on YouTube, I just saw a lot of people commenting. First of all, half the comments were like, I agree 100%. Unless they disagreed, they just weren't that interesting to me because it's like they didn't hear what I said. They heard what they wanted to hear. They saw it as gatekeeping or somehow I think that I don't care about like newer players or casual players in pinball, which is if you listen to it again, this is not what I said at all. So I'm sorry I have to waste my time for people who actually do listen to what I say. But just to clear things up, number one, Kevin and I are not gatekeepers in pinball at all. The reason we do this show is to educate and to help people and to explain things. The reason we started the Bro Show was to do tutorials on how to play pinball. That is our motivation for doing the Bro Show. That was the origins of it. When we run tournaments, we're very cognizant of trying to get new people in and making sure that there's special prize divisions for new people.
    65:43
    I've lost count of how many people in my personal life have got into pinball. I spend a lot of time thinking about pinball. I spend a lot of time thinking about what makes for a good game, and often what makes for a good game is a game that somebody who knows nothing about pinball can find satisfaction in And somebody who has been playing pinball as long as me and Kevin are into rules and deep knowledge of a game and have competent players can find value in. That is a good pinball machine. So I wasn't saying that we don't want to have pinball machines that are going to be off-putting to newer players. I said no more baby games. So if you're confused by that, I'd suggest going and watching it again.
    66:25
    Some points off the top of that is, like, you've got a game like Iron Man, and Iron Man's a punishing, brutal game for new players and experienced players, but it's fun. You know, Iron Man doesn't need to be a game that, like, a new player can play forever. It does one cool thing, which the Iron Mocker comes up and you bash it, and it's brutal and it's fun.
    66:45
    That's great. and more experienced players will maybe enjoy some of the rules of knowing what to start and what order, things like that, but it's a game that appeals to anybody. So I don't go back and listen to it. I don't want to spend much more time on that segment because this is just a function of talking to people that choose not to really hear what I'm saying, and they've got a preconception of it, and they want to argue me on that rather than bringing forth a good argument or a good counterpoint. And, again, I'll take responsibility maybe if I'm not cursing in a segment or coming off hot or strong on it. And, again, when you don't watch the whole podcast or you don't watch all our podcasts and you don't hear, I try not to repeat too many things, then I get it. Maybe you're responding to that, so that part's on me. But, you know, Kevin and I are not gatekeepers. Kevin and I both believe that a good pinball machine will have something to satisfy somebody who doesn't know anything about pinball and will satisfy a player who hasn't played for a long time, and that's the balance I'm trying to strike and the whole point of that segment. All right. Yeah, I appreciate that, and it's always good to, you know, go back, and especially with the JJP board thing, I'm like, I'm not going to get into it with the folks on Pinside because it's just going to turn into a shouting match on the Internet. We can go back here and readdress it, and then everybody has the benefit of, like, making sure we're all understanding things from the same perspective, so I appreciate that. alright let's jump over to what is quickly becoming one of our most favorite recurring segments on the show it's mods you don't need I feel like we need Tim Kittsrow doing an intro for mods you don't need but I do have a mod you don't need a lot of times so if you see a ridiculous pinball mod and you want to send it in talkpinball at gmail.com hit me up on discord this one I think somebody sent me this yeah this might have come from our buddy Matt in our group chat. So let's just jump over here. This is the, you have a Star Wars, a Stern Star Wars, or I suppose any Star Wars machine. And you are like, well, it's good, but what if it was a little more like the Exorcist?
    68:56
    This is the mod for you. It is the rotating Yoda head that you can put in your Star Wars for some reason.
    69:06
    Let me get the pricing on this for everybody. 160 pounds. Oh, no, euros. 160 euros. Wow. You two can have the rotating Yoda head inside your stern Star Wars.
    69:24
    Wait a minute. Ew. Why is it spinning? He'd be dead. Why is it spinning? Why? Yeah. No. Yeah. That is silly. 160 euros. for that. Oh, Jesus. Mods you don't need. Ladies and gentlemen, mods you don't need. You don't need that. Do not get that. Do not spend every six euros on that. He does also make a Stormtrooper helmet version of this, which I suppose is a little less weird because it could just be the helmet, not the guy's actual head spinning around. But,
    70:03
    still, for that much money, no. Hashtag mods you don't need. Okay. it's a quick one this month let's do some game room updates I've had some big game room updates so my biggest one is that my I switched it, swapped the pinball machine, I sold one and got a new one, Toy Story is out, my buddy Dave Sousa, Digital Jedi he's probably hanging in chat he really wanted a Toy Story and he's been hitting me up for mine since I got mine so I sold it to him it's his first Jersey Jack so congratulations to him he's enjoying it and one of the machines I've always kind of wanted and I've always liked but never pulled the trigger on for various reasons has been Alien and I was so my buddy Patrick had an Alien and I was going to buy it but he had already promised it to somebody else I was like alright I'll just sell Toy Story and it'll be like an open spot and when something comes along that that i want i'll have an open spot and some money i can buy it well like two days later uh patrick is like well my buddy went and bought his alien lv 2 so he doesn't need the standard version do you still want it i ended up getting a pretty good deal on alien standard version with the plus that it had a bunch of mods on it already which are really cool and alien to me there aren't many pinball machines that i think like really lend themselves well to mods personally i don't go overboard putting a bunch of mods on things uh but i think alien is one of them that that really kind of lends itself to it and he's got the mod that puts the apron on there uh the interactive apron that adds more lighting to the play field it also allows you to put the beacons on there like from the um the highway pinball original alien which is really cool and they integrate with gameplay so that's a mod i would have liked uh so i got that without having to install it also uh patrick did the the hard work of making sure everything works on the game that's one of the reasons why i didn't buy an alien uh for many years was because i would always hear about how many issues it had uh thankfully patrick went through it it's playing great haven't had any problems with it knock on wood um and it also came with the new protector set that recently came out somebody on Pinside is selling them so it's like you get the green neon green like plastic protectors which look really cool so I finished putting those on I'm super happy with it that game it's second only to Hobbit as far as David Thiel games come it might even surpass Hobbit I've always said Hobbit is my favorite David Thiel sound package and from a presentation and immersion standpoint, that game is incredible. And Alien is right there with it. And now that I have one in the house and can really appreciate it, I have an external sub hooked up to it. The game is really good. I'm really enjoying that game. So super happy with it. And it eats the ball. Thank you, RLM and chat. I'm slowly converting my entire lineup of games to games that eat the ball because that's all you need in pinball. I have a road show now and I have an alien. Both eat the ball. So let's go. we're making that Tron's going to have to go, it doesn't need the ball sorry everybody so that was the big thing the other big change was you can see it behind me here, my big buck that's normally lurking over my right shoulder is out and Nick's taken off, so I'll be right back he'll be right back, big buck is out the Jaguar games are in, look at that that's a good time because I can show you, look at that Atari Jaguar baby I got the whole collection right there. The full set is there in addition to my new on games and some other like switch stuff. I wanted to have, pull all that out of the closet and have it on,
    74:04
    have it on display. So that's cool. And I also moved my Jaguar kiosk over there. So it could be Jaguar corner. And there you go. The dream became reality. Big buck was out. I found a really cool local, local age collector. He's an hour or so away.
    74:19
    Who bought the big buck for his son as a gift. So it's got an easy high. So that's out. Loading that beast into his truck was not fun. I think it's heavy.
    74:33
    Those CRCs are heavy, but we got it out. I got cash. I got room. I got my Jaguar games on display. And in the video game front, I've been playing on the PS5 a lot. I've been playing.
    74:48
    I just finished. There's a new Robocop, Rogue City, it's called. Super fun game. I'll tell Nick about this Robocop Rogue City have you played that yet? I have not no highly recommended I just beat it totally nails the whole movie because I had recently rewatched Robocop and it's got like all the characters in there it puts you in the police precinct it looks exactly like it does in the movie they nailed it so highly recommend that game I beat that and I restarted Cyberpunk because they finally got that game to the point where it's not terrible and it's actually really good now so i went and i bought a used copy for the ps5 which gives you a free ps4 if you buy the ps4 version and you have a playstation 5 you get a free upgrade to the ps5 version so i'm playing the playstation 5 version for 20 basically um and it's been great so far i started over from the beginning um just because i wanted to get the full experience i'd played it like 15-ish hours or so on the PS4 version when it first came out, and then I got to this point where there was a game-breaking bug and I sold it. So highly recommended.
    75:59
    They have a new add-on to it, too, so I'll probably end up getting that. I played that a bunch yesterday. That's my game room updates. Nick, what have you been doing in your game room?
    76:11
    I've been playing a little bit of pinball. Stern's got his little March Madness thing, so I played some games this week just for the hell of it, just to do my part for the state of New York. But I've played a little more Pirates lately, which we're going to talk about because I just really wanted to play the game and get back into it. And then I've just been playing a lot of VR. This is like a VR time. I think that's going to be coming to an end when the weather gets better. But I've been playing a game called Contractor Showdown, which is in beta. It's like a battle royale. It's a very well-done game. So that's why I've been spending my time. Nice. And do you want to talk about your year and your view of owning Big Buck? Yeah, I can quick. I'll make this quick. So I've owned Big Buck Hunter Reloaded for about a year and a half now.
    76:56
    And this is a game, I've always been partial to Big Buck Hunter. I've never really gone out in public and played it, but it always was a shooting game that appealed to me. I feel like it is the best shooting game. I like the concept of it. I like the competitive aspect of it. I think there's a lot of features in it. It's great. So I finally bought one a year and a half ago. I got it from somebody who had bought it new. decided to sell it because they have a subscription model, which is $40 a month. And the guy was just like, yeah, I'm done with this, right? Like, I don't want to pay this. Now, you don't have to pay the $40 a month. You could take your machine offline, as they call it. But when you do so, you only get five animals, and you don't get to play online. So you don't get online scoreboard, where you can play against other people, which is just kind of like the most basic thing ever.
    77:46
    So I got it. I was super excited. I've played it for months. I like it. One thing that I like about it is I have this space in my game room where I can't put a pinball machine because I've got a closet behind there, but I can put that game there because it's got wheels on it. So whenever I need to get around it, or I've even got it pulled forward, I can walk around it. I can get to the closet. It just really works in my space.
    78:09
    So I think last year I paid $40 a month from, like, October to April. I played it a good deal because it was new. I even played it online against some folks like Ben Crane and our buddy Patrick bought one. Our buddy Patrick, like, played mine and was like, I've got to buy a big buck on her and went out and got one like the next day kind of deal.
    78:30
    Since then, he's ended up selling his a few months ago. I've seen other people sell their games. And honestly, if that space in my game room could have another pinball machine and that thing wasn't the heaviest thing in the world, I'd be tempted to sell mine. I just took it offline again because I was paying $40 a month and not playing it.
    78:52
    Part of the problem with the $40 a month thing is it gives you more animals, which is great. So you get like 10 animals instead of five. I think that's the number they're up to now. You get online scoreboards, which is, again, should be basic and free anyways.
    79:08
    And you can play like head-to-head with people online. It's cool. You also get the content called Reloaded. This is why it's Big Buck Hunter Reloaded, which has now The Walking Dead. They just added that. They've got Terminator game on there, and they've got some other games as well and, like, more bonus modes. Here's the problem. In a home environment, you're not going to play the Terminator game or Walking Dead much. Maybe you play it once or you have people over at a party and they play it because they're familiar with that at school. It's just not that fun. It's not that great. You're one and done. The main game is Big Buck Hunter. What I really wish they would do, and, again, I don't understand their business model. I'm sure they have their reasons, you know, but I don't understand it as a consumer. I wish I could just do, like, okay, access to the high scores for, like, $5 a month with the five animals. Or for $10 a month, I get all the animals and a scoreboard. Like, I do that. But the $40 a month, I'm paying for this reloaded content, which I do never play and don't care about. And I think most people are in that same boat. So then I've got to take the game offline, and it kind of sits there. So it's a real bummer. I love having a big buck hunter reloaded in my collection. I love going down and seeing it. I love that I have it, okay? Like, really happy. What is the gut punch is their subscription model is just terrible for the home consumer. Maybe it's that way because they kind of, like, don't really care about selling to the home consumer. It is a bar product. Like, I get that. So they're like, yeah, we'll let you as a home consumer. We'll sell it to you. You can do kind of these online features, but we're going to kind of put it at a price that doesn't encourage that. Maybe that's it. I don't know. And they even have the Big Buck Hunter tournament at the end of the year. And if I wanted to try to qualify for that, it's a worldwide tournament, not only do I have to pay the $40 a month just to play the game that everybody else is playing in a bar, I then have to also pay, like, I think $2 per attempt or something like that. It might be even, like, $5 for a full attempt. So I have to pay money on top of that to try to qualify. You've got to pay a lot of money to try to qualify. So it gets crazy expensive. It's just a really weird model. And I think it keeps a lot of people away from this game. Like, they'll buy it, they'll get enthusiastic about it, but eventually they'll look at spending $40 a month that's just sitting there. I mean, Kevin, you know, you buy a pinball machine. You don't play a pinball machine every day, right? There's months you probably don't play a certain pinball machine, but you're like, hey, I never want to sell this game. I love it. But suddenly if you had to pay $40 a month to really get the full features of that pinball machine, you probably wouldn't keep it, right? And that's the problem I have with Big Buck Hunter Reloaded. I really wish they would change their model. Like I said, I'm keeping mine because it sits in a space where I'm not sacrificing anything. It's just kind of like a plus.
    82:07
    But real warning and hesitation to anybody thinking about getting that. I think you need to take that into consideration first. You might not keep this game for long. Maybe you buy it, put it online, play it for six months, and move it down the road like most people do. That was kind of nice about the older one that I had. It didn't have that monthly fee, and it had all the features unlocked. Of course, it didn't have all the online connectivity or anything like that, too. So there were tradeoffs, but you could just kind of, like, have it sitting there and not be like, well, I'm not getting the full value out of this that I could be getting, right? So tradeoffs, but, yeah, I appreciate the year-in review. Look back on that, and I think other people who might be considering that will appreciate it as well. All right, we haven't done one of these in a while, and it's going to be our very first review of a Jersey Jack pinball machine and we figured why not start it out with, you know, one of the best games of all time. It's Pirates of the Caribbean. Let's play our intro. We haven't played that in a while either. We'll be right back. Let's go.
    83:20
    All right. It's Jersey Jack Pinball's Pirates of the Caribbean. This came out in 2018. Game design by Eric Minier. Mechanics by Dan Malter. Wally Welch. Yolanda Wisenton. Sorry. Joe Katz. J.T. Harkey and Keith Johnson on software. Jay Zielinski on artwork. John Paul DeWin on animation and Sound of Music by the Incredible David Thiel pricing at launch the good old days remember when everybody thought this was expensive so 2018 pricing $8,500 for the standard $9,500 for the LE $12,500 for the collector's edition for kicks I went on pin side for used older games we tend to give what they're going for now so I kind of pulled the median price it's about $16,000 for the standard about $20,000 for the LE and about $30,000 for the collector's edition they base those on sales that take place on pinside.com so this is a game that went insane in value and for good reason, right Nick?
    84:39
    for very good reason and I think that we should even before we get into the review we should teach there's a story behind this game I mean you gotta kind of address the elephant in the room why is it so much and it's kind of a tragic story in some ways if you think about it and I'm just going to say up front that I definitely put some thought into this review I've got about a page and a half notes so I'll kind of interject Kevin as we go through our usual format but for context for the viewers that maybe don't know this one of the highlights for Buffalo Pinball was going to do the reveal at Pinball Expo in 2017 of Jersey Jack Pirates.
    85:21
    And that stream's still up. Kevin, I take it? Yep. On our channel? I'll pull it up. I can show it while we're talking. And I remember seeing him playing this game. I remember Eric talking about the features in this game, and just, like, my mouth was wide open. This was a pivotal moment in pinball for me.
    85:41
    Yeah, the reveal stream and playing, it was a blur. I went to bed that night, and I woke up the next morning. You know, we're staying at Pinball Expo. We're in their hotel. I could not wait to run down to the floor to play this game. I've never in my life been so excited for a pinball machine than I was for Jersey Jack Pirates after having played it during that stream and wanting to play more. All I wanted to do was to keep playing this game, and it was the most impressive pinball machine I've ever seen. People often ask me, you know, what my favorite pinball machine is, And a lot of times I answer in terms of what I'm currently playing or something new I have. But the answer overall is Jersey Jack Pirates. It is my desert island game. It is the game I will take with me to the assisted living facility. It is the last game I would ever sell if I ever had to sell a game. I almost made a mistake of selling it last year because it's going for so much money. And thank God I didn't. But here's the story behind this and the price. Well, it's a great game, but the reason that the price is so crazy is that Jersey Jack, this is a huge blunder, unfortunately. I don't know all the details behind it. They've gotten way better since then. I think there's hard lessons learned. But they showed this off in October 2017 at Pinball Expo. The game did not ship until September 2018. Kevin and I got one of the first ones off the line. So already you've got so many people highlighted. It probably took so many preorders. But a year is a long time to have money kind of earmarked in your mind for a game. Other games come along, people get tempted, they spend money, and they get those games. The other things that happened is that there were features in there that they showed off and they said would be in the game that they had to take away. One was a disc was like a three-spinning disc. I think it's three, not four. Three-spinning disc, it all light up. It was definitely impressive looking. They had to change it to just a regular spinning disc. Okay, the chest would open and close. That no longer open and close. It's just open. So between a year and then having to come out and say we're taking features away from the game, I think people abandoned it. I don't think I know they did.
    87:57
    Then the game comes out in September of 2018. You know, it takes a while for the games to be made and delivered to people. Keith Johnson was on the show and we asked him why did this game stop being made and he said, look it's simple we had enough to make parts for like six months at that time we looked at the orders coming in, do we order more parts for this or do we move on to the next game there was not enough demand for more parts, hence they moved on to the next game, and they've never rerun this game, I don't know why they've not rerun this game, there's been speculation so there's licensing issues.
    88:36
    The bill of materials has to be expensive. You can always adjust for that in cost. There's obviously demand for this game. Will they ever rerun this game? I don't know. Nobody knows, okay? But that is the story. Now, the thing is, this game is a masterpiece. It took people, you know, probably that time from September through March to realize it's a masterpiece, and then it might even take us six months or a year, right, for some people to play it, to overcome the idea that there were things taken out of it and the game's not that good. It was also expensive at the time. I mean, $9,500 at that time was expensive for a pinball machine.
    89:13
    And now, you know, so many people who have been honest with themselves, I'll say that, realize that the game is something special and they want it. But unfortunately, there's just not enough of them made. And, Kevin, I'm going to try to pull this up. I'm sorry I don't have it ready. I want to look at how many exist. Maybe you can show it. Why don't you show it on your screen? Can you do that? I have the Pinside list. Because there's not a lot of them. I want to see the number of collectors. You want to go into, like, the owners here? Yeah, like, if you scroll down. Okay, so here's the LE that Kevin is showing.
    89:45
    378 people on Pinside reported to have this in their collections. There's 603 that want this game. There's only 14 on location in public. Think about that, guys.
    89:56
    This game, I'm going to tell you right now, this game, I promise you, if this game was made to meet demand, and this game was all over and people got access to it, I don't know how it could not be the number one game on Pinside. It is not. It's like 14th or 15th. It's something ridiculous. Foo Fighters is ahead of it. Like, mind-blowing. Like, that is. It's like Cactus Canyon for 14th. What a tragedy. It is a tragedy. You think about it, Kevin.
    90:24
    And this is like a lot of preamble before we talk about this game, but I want this is a love letter to this game. And it's also our first Sergi Jack review, so I really want to go hard on it.
    90:35
    There's 14 on location for the LE. We can look at the SE and the other ones, but most people haven't really gotten time to spend on this game. Maybe some people have played it in collections. There's 19 SEs. Usually when you play in somebody's collection, you don't really get to spend enough time. But there's 19 to SE. These games don't exist in the wild. They just don't. And 6. 6 CE. Yes, that is abysmal. People are not getting to play the best pinball machine ever made.
    91:04
    It's kind of heartbreaking. I really wish they'd rerun this. But I just want to put that context up and have people understand what's going on. And I do want to point out, this is my victory lap, and Kevin, please join me here. Okay. For a fucking full year.
    91:18
    Okay. After we played this game and revealed it, we came on the podcast and told everybody that this game is amazing. Like, this is a must-buy game. All right, so we did our part. I feel bad for the people who came into pinball. Like, they weren't in pinball at that time, so it was never an option on the table for them. That sucks. There's nothing you can do about it.
    91:40
    All right. Game is amazing. We, you know, we told you it was amazing. Some people took our word for it and bought it, and they were super happy with it. Other people sat on the sidelines. And I understand, like, $9,500, $8,500, that's still a lot of money, especially, you know, what, six years ago now. but this game is totally worth it. So Mr. Noob taxes that I think code would be the reason it's never number one. I disagree. The code is amazing. It doesn't have a wizard mode. We'll get to that.
    92:08
    But I don't think it's the reason. I think people don't have access. People tend to vote number one games for games that number one, if you buy the game, it's in your collection and there's a lot of people who own the game they're going to vote it number one because they have it it's the best game ever. Or if it's a game that's everywhere and they can play in location, they can do that as well because there's people that don't own games that will vote games high. If people aren't playing this game and they don't have access to it and can appreciate it, that's what's keeping it from number one.
    92:35
    That's what's definitely keeping it from number one. I agree. People need to get their hands on it. Code-wise, to that point, I think JJPs shine best when you have them at home and can really dig into them and you have the time and the ability to really appreciate the code. Although I will say, JJP, the structure of this code is pretty straightforward, but even so, to learn the nuances, I think that's really when it shines. Yeah, Kevin, you can roll with me. Keep us on track, but because you brought up code, I want to get into that, because there's this misconception about this game. And again, it's because people don't have access to it, and there's a difference between depth and something that's complicated, right? Or obtuse. right so this game has depth all right it like it has a lot to that i i understand like what somebody might say um it is but like at the end of the day all you need to know about this game is that to start a mode which they call chapters in the game you shoot the shot in the back um what Do you call that shot? It's the star map. The star map. It says chapter select. It's lit up. If it's not lit up, you basically hit any shot in the game, pretty much any shot in the game, almost any shot in the game. We'll light that up. That's all you've got to do. If you ever step up to it, that's all you've got to do. If you do that and you have a great game, you're going to get to probably one of the five mini wizard modes. You're not locked out from any of the mini wizard modes by just doing that very, very basic thing. There's games out there that if you don't do some, like, esoteric thing, you're not going to get to Wizard Mode. Not the case with this. This game is more straightforward than Rush.
    94:26
    So anybody who has a Rush and understands Rush and thinks this game is complicated, it's not. I own both games, I can tell you.
    94:33
    Okay? It's got depth, though. It definitely has depth to it. All right? Like, there's 22 different characters to choose from, So somebody's like, oh, my God, there's 22 characters.
    94:47
    That doesn't change the fundamentals of Star Chapter playthrough modes. Also, in this game, you're not locked out of things. Everything is available all the time, which is typical of a Keith Johnson game, right? I'm going to contrast that with Iron Man of all games, okay?
    95:07
    Iron Man doesn't have depth, but it is complicated in some ways. And I'll tell you why. In Iron Man, you've got to know order of operations. In Iron Man, if you start the Monger, you can't start Whiplash. Well, that's going.
    95:26
    Now, if you start War Machine, and that's going, then you can start Whiplash. Okay? If no Maws of Buzzer going on, you start Whiplash, then you can't start Monger. Right? There's a weird order of operations that you really got to have somebody tell you you've got to figure out and play a lot of times. These Jersey Jack games like this one and Godfather, they don't have an order of operations. You can start multi-balls at any time. You can start chapters and modes during multi-balls. Everything's just always happening. So maybe that's a little confusing, right? Because everything's always happening everywhere all at once, right? So it might seem like overload, but it's pretty straightforward. And all the chapters are is that there's going to be a movie scene, and whatever characters are in that movie scene, those character shots will be lit up on the playfield, and you shoot them. That's it.
    96:24
    That's it. Now, there's more. Let's talk about the depth for a second. So, we mentioned 22 different characters to choose from. All those characters, they have, like, it will say, like, what they do. Like, multi-ball timer's longer. Multi-ball save is longer.
    96:41
    You know, three chapters are lit. So three modes are lit at the start. You don't have to qualify them. Very, very, very straightforward. Now, some characters, yes, in terms of depth, they do have an extra perk that's not noted on that screen. But, again, you don't need to know that to get far into the game. That's not going to prevent you. Characters are definitely well-balanced.
    97:02
    So, I know it can be overwhelming. I know people only have access to this game, but the game is very intuitive and makes logical sense. Very much so.
    97:13
    One thing I really want to talk about, I'm going to bounce around. I'm going to try not to miss anything. I did not do a good job in organizing my notes here, but speaking of a character selection,
    97:27
    another criticism that I hear is theme integration, so I'm bouncing around. Kevin, forgive me. Some people are like, oh, the theme isn't good. because, like, I don't know, they don't have... It doesn't show movie clips. No, it shows movie clips, but it doesn't show the actors in those movie clips. Exactly, exactly. But the actors are all over the game. Like, their names are all over the game. You select the characters. Like, they're all over the game, right? Like, it's a stupid thing, in my opinion. But let me explain this for the level of theme integration that this team did, which is why it's a masterpiece. Remember, there's 22 characters. so they in terms of giving these characters perks it wasn't a mindless decision on what perks to give characters I'll give you an example Rigetti is that pirate who looks like me if I was on meth and had one eye he's that guy in the movie he's missing an eye his ability is when you're on the ship if you hit the action button you'll put another ball into play you get a two ball multi ball when you're on there by hitting the button. That's his perk. Because he's missing an eye. Two eyes. There you go. Elizabeth Swan.
    98:36
    Elizabeth Swan, played by Keira Knightley, who is the biggest Mary Sue I've ever seen in a movie. Ruins it pretty much. But anyways, it won't get me going.
    98:45
    She starts a game with three chapters. Chapters are modes, if you remember. Always lit. Why is that Because she a strumpet and she juggling multiple dudes in the movie She juggling She got Jack Sparrow or whatever his name is and Will Turner Like, whether it be Swan. He's a character you select. He is immune to being plundered. Why? Because he's the governor. And on and on and on. They did this for 22 characters. Is that theme integration? I'm going to say yes. More theme integration than any pinball machine I've ever played in my life. More thought has gone into that than anything.
    99:28
    The other theme integration, we'll bounce around this as rules. Each movie chapter you play, you have to hit characters in that scene, which I mentioned.
    99:38
    They had to go through all the scenes and figure out what characters are in that scene because those are the character shots that are lit up in the game.
    99:46
    They didn't have to do that. They could have just made it like any old game, this arrow's lit, that arrow's lit, and that never changes. But that's in there.
    99:56
    And by the way, do you know how many chapters or modes are possible in the game, Kevin? A lot. I remember that. There's five movies in this game. Okay, all five movies are represented. And each five movie has five chapters slash modes. Okay? But each movie, before the game starts, will select between one of 20 to 26 chapters or modes.
    100:26
    Okay? So just think about that for a second. You're only going to play, like, on Stranger Tides. That's the movie? Yeah. But on Stranger Tides, when you start a game, the game's going to randomly pick five modes from a potential 21 to 26 for that movie. So those scene clips are in there from that movie. And it's going to do that for all five movies.
    100:53
    So, you know, one of the kind of bragging points is there's like 3.4 sextillion possible combinations. You'll never play the same game twice. That may seem overwhelming, but if you listen to what I'm saying, you walk through this.
    101:08
    You just start a mode. Multi-balls will happen by starting shots. It's just an impressive masterpiece of a game and theme integration and love that unfortunately the crime here is that most people just, the owners know, I know, Kevin knows, but I don't think it's represented. And that's why I wanted to really spend time talking about this game on the podcast and doing justice to it, to just let everybody know. Not what you're missing, because I really hope that, like, you know, I see a lot of Cope, like, oh, the game's slow, complicated, and there's no team integration. I'm like, no, you're wrong. I don't know if that's Cope. I don't know if it's just that you did not spend time with it. But I promise you, if they re-ran this game, so many people who have had Cope about it will get their wallets out. And they should. They should. And Kevin's showing some gameplay of, you know, he keeps on going back to when we were doing the reveal stream. The game is not slow at all, man. That thing is brutal with the disc. Even when they change the way the disc works, it's brutal. You've got to stay on your toes. Always something happening.
    102:16
    I think the single disc is more dangerous than the triple disc was. Yeah, maybe. I'm not spending enough time. There's five mini wizard modes in the game. The biggest problem with this game is that it's missing the wizard mode at the end of the game. There is a rumor that they've not abandoned this game. so will we ever see it? I have no idea. I hope to God. I mean, it's an unfinished masterpiece. So, Kevin, I did a lot of talking because I really wanted to try to clear up some confusion or common criticisms when I hear this game and why people say what they say. I think I did a pretty good job, but why don't you where do you want to take this? Yeah, I think you did a good job of covering a lot of the more there tends to be like a dialogue that happens around every game. There's certain talking points that get hit and, you know, for whatever reason, you know, those are some of the ones for pirates. So good job setting the table. You talked about rules, so I think you got a good handle on that. Let's move on. Let's talk about some of the other, like, categories that we talk about when we do a pinball machine review. So let's talk about the art. The art, like you mentioned, it has all the characters. they have like a realistic hand-drawn hand-painted feel to them so if you like say you know Christopher Franchi style art I would say that's that's the kind of feel you get with the artwork on this it's not my favorite but I think it fits for a license like this where you have to get image likenesses of actors and get them approved and and have it look realistic without necessarily just being pictures photoshopped and dropped onto a play field. The play field itself, it looks good. Like the use of color is good. It's not overly filled with art, so you can follow the ball. I think it does a good job through the style we are showing where the shots go and the different colors that correspond with the different inserts for the different movies and things like that.
    104:24
    Yeah, and overall, you get the kind of this. It feels like you're playing a pirate game. There's, like, the ship has a wooden plank surface that you play on, and it's got the other ship in the back left corner that looks good and the treasure chest. And the cabinet art is kind of whatever. It's good, but it's not among my favorites. But I think they did a good job with it overall. I wouldn't say it's one of the best art packages in pinball, but it gets the job done, you might say. Gets the job done.
    104:55
    Any other thoughts on the art? No, no. I think you've covered it. Okay. Sound? Wow. Can we talk about the sound? Sound is amazing. I mean, I know you said Hobbit. Maybe it is, but to me, this is the best sound package. Yeah. Or at least right up there. David Thiel absolutely crushed it. I love the fact that they got Gibbs from the movie as the voice actor to do call-outs. He absolutely nails it. Like, some of the best call-outs in pinball, bar none. So I forgot how many music scores David Thiel composed for. I think each character has their own or mode, but there's a lot of music in this game for sure.
    105:36
    Yeah, David did a great job with the sound. It's a mix of like, I think it's mostly David Thiel songs in it, but they're all piratey and on point. The sound effects too are just really good. I think about the chapter start sound effects. When you hit the loop and it's got the sing-songy sound that happens, and they're all just really good. When you start a multi-ball and it's got the pistols that fire off, David knows what he's doing. He obviously just nails it.
    106:15
    Incredible sound package. I think Hobbit is still better in my book, But obviously this is up there with the best, absolutely.
    106:23
    By the way, I missed a real point that I should – the real shame is that we're going to miss something about this game. Yeah. We're talking about it.
    106:34
    But one thing I missed, because I don't look at it or think about it, but the game literally has an LCD, okay, by the lockdown bar, which shows you at all points in time what the best shot to hit is. you can play the game and you can just say, how do you play the game, Beck? You see that compass down there? Just hit the shot that it's showing you to hit. That's it. This game couldn't be easier for somebody who doesn't know what's going on. It's kind of insane. There's no other pinball machine that I know of that has anything like that. Yeah, it's a really cool feature.
    107:11
    And it's one of those things where let's just make it super easy for folks. And, again, it's thematically integrated because in the movies, that's what, you know, it's like your heart's desire or whatever. And the compass is what the compass points to. So it's a compass. It points to the most valuable thing on the play field. Again, another level of theme integration that just kind of sets the game apart.
    107:38
    Okay, so we talked about toys. Oh, my goodness, the toys on this. even minus the triple spinning disc and opening and closing chest, you've got one of the most amazing playfield toys slash mini playfields. I don't know. I consider it more of a toy because it's like this massive mechanical masterpiece in the upper right-hand corner of the game, which is the Black Pearl, the rocking ship. And what makes it more than just an upper playfield is that there's a cannon on the left-hand side of it that you can load and fire across the playfield to sink another physical ship on the playfield. It's one of the coolest physical things in a pinball machine, in my opinion. 100%. Man, that ship never gets old. It's super fun, upper playfield, very, very cool. Again, theme integration of hitting the spinners represent the sails, hitting that, and then you can see the progress, and then loading the cannon and finally firing the cannon. Again, great theme integration in terms of toys and what's actually on the play field.
    108:43
    We'll get into the display, but all that incorporates nicely into the display as well in terms of it's only a user. What's going on and representing that in kind of a really nice artistic way. Yeah. And even the chest is a super cool ball lock, even though it's not. It doesn't have the opening and closing on the released version. And you can mod that. There's a mod you can get, and I have it on mine, where you can make it open and close. but yeah the ship itself puts this in top tier and even just the other physical features of this game like the whirlpool ramp on the left that can divert, you can either come back around as a ramp shot or divert into the whirlpool and the ship are just two other cool, super cool features and of course it's got, the release version has the single spinning disc which again it's integrated with the theme it's the map, it adds some chaos and randomization to the game, which keeps it fun and interesting. I think that's one of the other things, like, from a general standpoint, this game does a really good job of being a wide body that doesn't feel slow and floaty, right? It feels fast and snappy.
    109:50
    The action is it's got the, what, four pop numbers on the left-hand side, the spinning disc. The ramp shots are pretty close to the flipper, so if you miss, you're going to pay. The interesting in-lane, out-lane configuration keeps you making sure you have to nudge a lot so you don't just kind of like hit a shot and take a nap and wait for the ball to come back. You have a good time. And this game does the great balance that I was talking about with Godfather as opposed to Led Zeppelin or Rush where you can – some games can be extremely short and brutal. Like the ball save is not on by default. That spinning disc is just absolutely – it can be absolutely brutal when it's on.
    110:29
    The slingshots are powerful and snappy. There's a lot of ways that, and the shots are close, there's a lot of ways to die in this game that you really need to get the multiballs strung together, working towards the multiballs, so you can play safely through it and progress towards the end. So I have games that are brutally short. I have games that are long. I have games that are medium. And that's what I love about a pinball machine and want to keep a pinball machine. I was playing Rush the other day, and it's like, man, I love that game, but every time I play it, it turns into, like, this hour game, and it's just almost unplayable for me at this point. Whereas this, it's like I don't know what I get. If I'm playing great, I'm going to play it for a long time, but there's no guarantee of that. I've got to – I cannot be an autopilot. I've got to be on, and I've got to be focused at all times because that ball is truly wild in that game.
    111:21
    Completely. I nailed it. All right, you mentioned display. Let's talk about display and lighting. You want to take the lead? Yeah, sure. I mean, GP to win. Just this is my favorite display of the Jersey Jack games. I think it's just very well done. One criticism is you can't see the actors in the movie clips. It's fine. I'm not here to watch a movie. The movie clips are short and brief. They set the stage for that, and you're playing through it. But I love kind of the always-on display, as you can kind of see right now. Kevin's got the screen. It's showing the chapters that are available, obviously the score. But represented on there on that map is the progress that you're making towards a multiball. Like, for example, I think it's Dead Man Telling Little Tales, the purple one, right, Kevin? Yeah. As you hit that spinner, it's on the far right side. There's a ship, and you can see every time the spinner's going, the ship is moving towards like an island. It's so cool. It's such a nice representation of how close. It's not like the screen saying, oh, 50 more spins to multiball. Like, no, no, no. You could just see that, oh, I'm hitting it. The ship's getting closer. The ship's really quick. Probably one more rip and I've got a multiball. It's such a beautiful, artistic thing that's going on. Communicates all the information you need to know.
    112:42
    I don't know, man. Again, what more can I say? The game is such a masterpiece. And it fires on all cylinders in every aspect. The lighting, while they don't have the hot rails, is that what they're called, Kev? Yeah. They don't have, they weren't, Jack wasn't doing it then. I can only imagine how it would look. Still brilliant. Still brilliant lighting effects.
    113:03
    Kevin, like, you know, like the extra ball one or like the, at the end of the game, like kind of like the water waves, how it flashes blue lower on and then kind of like the night sky towards the top. Yeah, so good. How, when you're in a certain mode, it's like that mode's color and all, like the GI. Yeah. I was just like, the game is something else. And as I'm going on and on, like, I don't know if we're ever going to see a game like this again. Like, just with the amount of toys in there, the amount of mechanical stuff in there,
    113:35
    losing David Theo is definitely a loss. I mean, I think Godfather, this sounds great, but, like, we might not ever see a pinball machine like this for either a long time or maybe never again. This was, I think, again, the tragedy of this game is that they really went all out with it. They threw everything in the kitchen sink. This was what Jersey Jack had kind of been moving up towards in many ways, right? They're really dialed in at this point, which is a funny expression to use in this situation. But they're really dialed in with Pirates. And just kind of the botched launch and the fact that this didn't sell for years and years and years where everybody bought one, I think hurts the idea of a company spending this much time and getting to this level of detail on a pinball machine. It's a real shame. This is a bit of a side tangent, but do you feel like this game is what fueled all the FOMO in pinball that we had during COVID? And I think it continues to a point. You think this is the catalyst for that?
    114:32
    I'm sure it had some effect, right? Like, it definitely has some effect. How much to what extent? I don't know. I really don't. Yeah. Because people saw this game went up in crazy value, and they didn't want to miss out in case there was some amazing game that came out. They wouldn't want to have to spend like $20,000 on it if they didn't buy it at launch. I hate how much this game is worth. I hate it more than somebody that doesn't own it. Because this game could go to $50,000, and I wouldn't want to sell it. It could go to $100,000, and I wouldn't want to sell it. And that sucks. That's a lot of money to have in a game. just a pinball machine that was $9,500 at launch. That really sucks. If you want to keep this game forever, then it doesn't matter what the price is.
    115:22
    And the problem is, too, let's say it goes $50,000 and I want to sell it. I'll never get it back. That's the thing. I'll never get this game back. If I sold Metallica, there's a million Metallicas out there. I can get it back. So many people will sell a game and then buy it back because there's plenty of them out there. It is very, very difficult with this game to do that. Yep. So that's another problem. And then we also get into, like, parts. Like, I would love them to rerun it so there's more parts for the game. Now, my games held up immaculately well, and so does Kevin's. I mean, that's a testament to the build quality of Jersey Jack. Kevin, you've played the shit out of your game. I have. You streamed it a lot. Have you ever rebuilt the flippers by any chance? Nope. I bet that's a discrepancy between yours and mine. You've played yours more than I because you just streamed it a lot. Yeah. But remember you were saying, like, your flippers couldn't get up. I bet if you rebuilt the flippers or changed the coils and stuff. Anyways, I digress. Mine have always been like that, though. My right ramp has always been hard on mine. I don't know. It's just something. You know, pinball machines are different. But, yeah, I'm sure a rebuild would help, too. Yeah. But, yeah, it's been holding up great. Let's talk about gameplay overall, like the shots, like the geometry of it. What do you think on that? I mean, it's a great layout. It's got some unique things going on. I do like the spinning disc. We've seen spinning discs in games before, but it's integrated nicely with the theme.
    116:41
    That spinning disc goes off when you hit the map targets, and you've got to put it in the map hole, and it will give you a random combination of an award.
    116:50
    I forgot how many. I have it in somewhere of how many combinations. Anyways, not important right now. Yeah, it's a lot. It's got some unique things. It's got, like, if it goes out the right outline, there's a chance for it to go back into the shooter lane. I mean, games have done similar things, but you don't see it too often. It's got an interesting design on the left side with the three-drain thing. It's almost like a paragon kind of thing, where if it goes in the middle, it drains. If it goes in the far left, it's safe. If it goes to the one to the right in the middle, it's safe. So that's something you don't see often in games anymore.
    117:25
    It's got that nice, really, loop shot. You hit it from the right flipper through the chest. when the chest's not locking it, it comes around to that upper left flipper, and then you can keep on looping it and looping it and looping it, which will start a multi-ball, or you can also hit the goal targets, you can hit the map targets, or you can hit the map hole, right? Like a lot of things to shoot for in this game by far. And again, I've already mentioned the upper play field, but a very fun upper play field where it feels fun being up there. You're not up there forever. Again, you've really got to be focused because the thing's moving, trying to hit the shots.
    118:02
    You're lucky if you're up there for a few seconds at the time. I'm just glad we get to watch Jay play a little bit here. It's really the highlight of the show so far. Yeah, I love the – and I mentioned this before with the overall layout of a wide body. Sometimes they can feel kind of wide open or there's not a lot on there or the shots take forever to kind of come back around and you don't get that impression at all from this game.
    118:25
    It's not a super – I wouldn't call it a flow monster of a game, but you can really get into ripping those ramps. And the loop shot is probably the most satisfying shot on it to me, just ripping it over and over with that upper flipper. It's like Buddha. Like Buddha. Yeah, and it's got that cool shot when you're in the Tia Dama shot, where you're in the at-world's-edge multi-ball, the super jackpot. You obtain that by holding up the left flipper, and there's a hole in the play field that you get the ball to fall down into. So, you know, it's really amazing that this is Eric's first game, right? Like, you'd see this from a seasoned designer, and he crushed it. And as I'm watching the video that Kevin's playing, I saw that one thing that I forgot to mention. This game has a feature called Plunder, which makes this a very, very fun multiplayer game where, into the theme integration again, where one of the map awards will give you the chance to plunder an opponent's ball or score or their character, right? It makes it kind of like an interactive board game in the sense that what you're doing in the game can affect the other players. And that's fine. I mean, you can turn that off if you don't like it. I love it. You know, I used to turn it off in League and be like, oh, you shouldn't be able to plunder the other. Like, why? That's the game. That's the fun. That's the strategy, right? You can start hammering the map targets and then trying to get that award so you can play your opponent's ball. Suddenly you've got an extra ball and they've lost the ball.
    120:01
    But, I mean, the downside of trying to do that is that you're going to activate the spinning disc, which can make your play harder. Like, it's so cool. There's so much going on in this game. But it's not complicated. No. We didn't even talk about, like, Liar's Dice is in there. Yes, that's right. It's got a little mini video mode game in there. Yeah, and you can play it just like they do in the movie. They play a lot. It's nice. You can play it and gamble away your gold or some of your treasures and things like that. Tilt warnings. It's pretty crazy.
    120:35
    Yeah, there's just so much. I know we're going to miss something, but I think we've done a good job. Let's talk about Last Ability. We've had this game since launch. You've said it's never leaving your collection. Last Ability? Yeah, it's a forever pin. Easy. It's my grail pin. It's the forever pin. It's something I'm super proud to own. It's something I'm very fortunate to own. I tell Eric once a year, thank you for making this game. It is just something special.
    121:02
    Agreed. You documented some of the stats on how varied the gameplay is rules-wise, and I think that holds up. It's not just a marketing point. It is a good marketing point, but it's also reality, reality and that you have so many different characters, so many different modes, all the different multiballs you can play. You can try to stack all six multiballs.
    121:25
    If you want to just plow through the game, you can pick Norrington and, you know, break your way to the end of the game, you know. But it still takes a lot of effort to get there, even with the characters that help you get there.
    121:38
    Yeah, and look, we didn't even talk about some things like, oh, there's a button on the game and what does that do? Again, you don't need to know that to progress through the game. You don't need to know that to, if you're playing a long ball and having a good game in that sense of just keeping the ball and playing and hitting shots, if you don't know that, you're still going to beat people who have a shorter game and know that, right? Like, you don't, it will give you an advantage as any pinball should where you know the rules, but it's not such a lopsided thing where that's such a harm of not knowing it. But speaking of which, you know, like that, there is that button there and you can choose, you get choice in the game. So, I mean, first of all, you get choice of the character when you start it, and then that action button will let you choose, do I want a 2X? And you complete that by hitting the pirate in lanes, out lanes, and spelling pirate, and then hitting the pirate shot next to the chest. But there's, like, whole bonus you can select as a thing. There's an add a ball during multi-ball. There's the super X, which will be a play field multiplier. There's a shot X. There's a hurry up. These are things that all people know anyways. I mean, they're not super complicated. There's gold in the game. I see new players, they don't understand gold. I'm going to tell you right now, everybody, here's how gold works.
    122:44
    When you hit the gold targets or you complete character shots in the game or you get a random reward, you'll probably hear GIF say, gold, aha. All right, it'll make a little noise. It'll be a gold noise. There's a flasher by the left upper flipper that changes to gold in color. All you've got to do is keep on hitting that action button until it turns off. Stop hitting it after it turns off. You're not doing anything. There's also the LCD, which is hard to see. That's also indicating what's going on. I know the game is chaotic and you're trying to collect gold while the action is happening, which makes it fun. That's it. And then once you get 50 gold, you get to go to Tortuga Multiball. Oh, Jesus, there's Marco. I had to switch back for that.
    123:26
    So, again, a lot going on. Depth, not complicated. All right. Yeah, it's one of those games where, like, surface level, it's pretty straightforward. You can get through the game. But over time, as you have it in your house and you dig deeper, you can get into all this other stuff, which is what makes it such a great game in the long term for your home, right? Like, that's what you want for a home game. You want something you can get into easily, a theme you like that kind of, like, sets the stage for an enjoyable experience. and then once you've had it and you've played it a bunch, there's still new things to discover and new things to do. One of the other things overall that I like about this game that we haven't talked about a lot is just the number of diverters and the way the ball pass has become a thing, I feel like, since Godfather. But that's the thing that keeps games interesting to me is that you're not always getting the same return from the shot that you hit, right? The shot to the chest can either come around or it can get locked in the chest. If you shoot the shot to the left of the chest, it can either come all the way around through the pops or it can get grabbed by a magnet and fed up into the ship. The left ramp, it can go all the way around and return to a flipper or it can go into the maelstrom ramp and come out of scoop. all sorts of good stuff there's subways under there that keep the ball coming out in interesting places this is like a lightning in a bottle kind of game I think Nick you nailed it where you said we're not going to see a game like this again for a long time I mean I hope we do but it seems unlikely for a number of reasons why this game is as good as it is and why it's so unlikely to happen again anytime soon yeah I don't know. I'm going to go play it today again because I love it so much.
    125:29
    I think the only downside to this game is there's no final wizard mode in it. Yeah, so this game, I'm going to give my review right now. It's a 9.9. Usually we do a solid number or a half. It has no wizard mode. Okay, and that is to me it's very very disappointing. This game is a masterpiece and not to put the final touch on it do not put something that is absolutely should be in the game. It's not like this was a game created that had no intention of having a wizard mode and that's what it is. No. It's missing something that's supposed to be in their game. It's not finished by the team.
    126:10
    I don't know why this happens. I wish Jersey Jack would have a policy that they wouldn't do something or wouldn't allow this or at least provide an explanation to us.
    126:21
    It kills me that there's not. I mean, I actually stopped playing this game shortly after I got it because I was having a really good game one day and I you know, I was like, I could see myself maybe getting to the end. I didn't want to spoil it. Maybe that's a weird way to think.
    126:35
    And then I just, as the years as time went, as the months went by and then years, I was like, oh my god. It's so weird. Now, people say, oh, it's a Wizard Mode nobody's ever going to see. It doesn't matter. that's not like it doesn't it's supposed to have something this game is not finished now this game has more code more features more depth than any game I can think of that's ever been made okay that's a profound statement so even without the wizard mode it has more than any game you can go out and buy on the market right now but it needs the also it's also true that it needs the wizard mode to be in there to be a completed masterpiece and I hope to God that we see it. I hope this team, I hope this builds more interest in Pirates. I hope it gives a level of appreciation for a game that some people haven't seen. Seek one out. You know, I've got, we've got friends in League. I was like, anytime someone wants to come over, you want to play, I'll show you how to play the game. You can spend some time on it. All right, like, this game's amazing. We've done a tutorial on it years ago, really trying to explain it for people. and I get like it's rough because like I would never go out and buy a $20,000 game, $25,000 game it absolutely sucks, especially a used game I wouldn't do that so I can see like being apathetic about it but just don't kid yourself this is something else and let's all hope that it gets remedied and we'll see this rerun. I mean if Nick's going to give it a 9.9 I'm going to do it too because I think we don't always agree on games, but this is one we definitely agree on.
    128:14
    Incredible, incredible game. Once in a generation kind of game. Somebody kind of drew a parallel between that and Twilight Zone of its time. I can see the comparison there.
    128:27
    Yeah, 9.9, put that wizard mode in, and it's a 10. All day, every day. All day. It deserves to be a 10. It needs that wizard mode. It is this game is 9.9 from the asterisk should be a ton. All right. I think you've heard it here.
    128:43
    What's going on? All right. I think that's going to do it for this episode of Brody Even Talk Pinball. I'm glad we could do another review. It's been a while.
    128:53
    We got to pull some winners, though. So let's jump over to our winners. Hashtag win if you aren't in yet and you're in the Twitch chat. We'll give you a minute to jump in. While we do that, I'll show you the screen. We're up to 43 entries. And I'll give a shout-out. If you haven't yet, go to buffalopinball.com slash merch to buy some Buffalo Pinball gear. If you're going to Texas Pinball Festival and you want to be looking good, grab yourself a Buffalo Pinball shirt and wear it there. Represent us and the crew with pride. You can follow us on social media. We're on all of them. well most of them we're not on Mastodon or anything weird like that but all the major ones email if you got feedback you want us to answer a question something like that talkpinball at gmail.com is the place to go you can follow us on Twitch if you want to support the channel a great way to do that is with a Twitch subscription if you have Amazon Prime you get Twitch Prime for free which gives you a free sub every month although Amazon is making that harder and harder to find it's still there and you want to give a free sub, Twitch Prime is a good way to do that. You can also send us a little tip by PayPal, buffalopinball.gmail.com, or you can drop us a review on your podcast platform of choice. That helps folks find us in the future. So, all right, that's it. We're going to go ahead and draw an entry. The first one is going to be for the $50 gift card for Titan Pinball. Thank you to Titan Pinball. We're going to go ahead and draw an entrant. The winner is Kid Pinball. I've seen Kid Pinball in chat. Kid Pinball, if you agree, we will go ahead and mark that as yours. I'll announce it in chat.
    130:39
    And the second one will be for the set of Penn Stadium Neo Adams. We're going to go ahead and draw that here.
    130:47
    Digital Jedi, we know him. Congratulations, Digital Jedi. Kid Pinball is in. Digital Jedi is in. So congratulations to both of you.
    130:59
    Digital Jedi, I'll just text you. Kid Pinball, I will send you a whisper on Twitch. So watch your whispers. Those are the private messages on Twitch. And I'll send you a message. We'll get your information. And then we'll go from there. We'll make sure you get your $50 Titan gift card. So thank you, everybody, for another great episode of Birdie Even Talk Pinball. Sadly, there is no Topper Talk. Gorian's in the middle of moving or something. He's probably just hanging out at Disney World and too busy riding the Tron Coaster. to join us and give us a Topper Talk. But hopefully next month we get another Topper Talk. Thanks, everybody.
    131:36
    Scott, Denise, and Chad, thanks for the technical details on the J.J.P. board set so people don't think I was talking out of my ass. All right. Nick, what are your final words? Treat yourself to some Buffalo Pinball merch. You deserve it.
    131:50
    All right. We'll see you next month. Bye, y'all.