American Pinball Legends of Valhalla and Pinball Expo 2021(Ep.65)

A Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·20m 37s·analyzed·Oct 25, 2021

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.032

TL;DR

American Pinball announces Legends of Valhalla with 300-500 units; Expo 2021 schedule reviewed.

Summary

The host discusses American Pinball's announcement of Legends of Valhalla, a 22-mode Viking-themed pinball machine originally from Riot Pinball, now being released with 300 Limited Deluxe units (later increased to 500). The game features three flippers, three ramps, Thor's hammer, 100+ RGB lights, and an $8,395 MSRP—the lowest-priced deluxe machine in the current market. The episode also covers Pinball Expo 2021 schedule and events, with the host expressing skepticism about the theme's strength but optimism about American Pinball's ambitions.

Key Claims

American Pinball increased Legends of Valhalla deluxe production from 300 to 500 units due to demand
medium confidence · Kingpin Games floated this update 14 hours before recording; host notes this hasn't been confirmed by other distributors yet
Legends of Valhalla has 22 total modes: 16 legend battle modes (5 multiball), 6 other modes (3 multiball), Valhalla wizard mode, and Ragnarok super wizard mode
high confidence · Host cites promotional materials and zoom-in visual confirmation
Legends of Valhalla MSRP is $8,395, the lowest-priced deluxe/LE machine compared to Spooky ($9-10k), Stern ($10k+), and Jersey Jack ($12k+)
high confidence · Host states MSRP directly and compares to known competitor pricing
The game features Thor's hammer that some players have gone 5-20 games without activating
medium confidence · Host cites reports from people who played on location
Legends of Valhalla is the first American Pinball game to feature 100+ RGB lights, compared to Stern's typical 13-20 RGB lights
medium confidence · Host estimates based on memory of other games' specifications
American Pinball strategically placed Legends of Valhalla machines at locations across the country (California, South Carolina, Chicago, Minnesota, New York) for awareness-building rather than testing
medium confidence · Host speculates on manufacturer intent based on rapid internet discovery of machines

Notable Quotes

“Because to me, if you're putting out something that's supposed to be limited and people are ordering early on for that particular game based off that model number or that amount of units, I think you should stick to that.”
A Pinball Podcast host @ ~10:40 — Direct criticism of American Pinball's decision to increase limited edition production mid-presale cycle
“I personally feel like the theme is the weakest part of the game... when it comes to pinball, the last thing that you want to be the weakest part of your game is the theme.”
A Pinball Podcast host @ ~15:45 — Core design criticism: theme is identified as the machine's primary weakness
“I hope it works out. I hope they sell out of everything and I hope they get to keep churning out machines because I think any new pinball is great overall.”
A Pinball Podcast host @ ~17:20 — Shows measured optimism for American Pinball despite reservations about the specific game
“If this would have been that [MCU Thor], I might have personally had a hard time saying no to it.”
A Pinball Podcast host @ ~16:45 — Acknowledges theme licensing impact on sales appeal, implies MCU would have been stronger choice
“Personally, I don't think that they would [announce at Expo], just because I feel like they still need to get some more games out.”
A Pinball Podcast host @ ~31:00 — Prediction about Jersey Jack's Expo strategy; suggests prioritizing game distribution over announcement splash

Entities

American Pinballcompany Legends of ValhallagamePinball Expo 2021eventRiot PinballcompanyKingpin GamescompanyPinball Starcompany David FixpersonJeff T. OluspersonTwo Steps to Hellcompany

Signals

~
sentiment_shift: Host expresses frustration with American Pinball's mid-presale production increase, views as breach of limited edition promise to early orderers
high · Direct quote: 'If you're putting out something that's supposed to be limited...I think you should stick to that. So it's kind of a dicey thing.'
?
design_philosophy: Host identifies theme as weakest element of Legends of Valhalla despite strong mechanical and code specifications
high · Explicit statement: 'theme is the weakest part of the game' and 'when it comes to pinball, the last thing that you want to be the weakest part of your game is the theme'
?
design_philosophy: American Pinball positioning second game (Legends of Valhalla) with increased ambition in code and multiball features compared to debut title (Hot Wheels)
medium · Host states 'they're a little bit more ambitious this time around when it comes to overall code and when it comes to the amount of modes'
?
event_signal: Pinball Expo 2021 features heavy Stern focus with 6 Saturday sessions dedicated to designer talks, LED Zeppelin showcase, and Godzilla presentation
high · Schedule shows 3-10 p.m. Saturday dominated by Stern sessions including Led Zeppelin, Jurassic Park, Mandalorian, Godzilla
?
licensing_signal: American Pinball deliberately avoiding licensed IP to control costs and differentiate from competitors; MCU Thor would have been stronger theme appeal
medium · Host notes non-licensed strategy, speculates MCU version would increase sales appeal significantly

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.062

0:00

all right guys welcome back to another episode of a pinball podcast thank you guys so much for being here i greatly do appreciate it and apologies in advance i'm battling a little bit of a cold right now and I don't have the mute button near me. So if you hear sniffles or random coughs, apologies ahead of time. Anyhow, let's get right to it. And I know I'm a little bit behind on all the content lately, so we're just going to skip right ahead to what's relevant this week leading up to Expo. I'll talk about my thoughts on Godzilla on the next podcast as I finally have some games on it. I'll talk about my thoughts on Halloween on another show as well as I have plenty of games on there. But today we're going to talk about Legends of Valhalla from American pinball and we're going to talk a little bit about Expo. So in case you've been living under a rock for the past couple of days, American Pinball has actually announced Legends of Valhalla. And as you can tell right here, if you're watching on YouTube, thisweekinpinball.com has its pinball deep dive, of course, that they always do across all the games, all the manufacturers, which is great. But American Pinball did something a little bit different here. They ended up putting games out on location across the country. Like we're talking locations out in California. I think a location in South Carolina with Fred Richardson's area, I believe. I think Fred owns that. I forget. Either way, I know it's at Bang Back. And I think there's also units that are around Chicago. And I think one even went up to Minnesota. So and then Jack Bar also out in New York. So they're basically everywhere, which is an interesting thing as that's the way it used to be about two, three decades ago, however long it's been, to where these manufacturers would put the games out on location early on to get testing out of the way. Now, I'm not so sure if this was really the intention as these games just went out just a couple of days ago. And, of course, now everybody knows about it this day and age on the Internet. And I don't know so much if it's out there for testing as it is just to build up awareness and kind of nearly like a viralness to it, to have people start talking online just as if we're doing right now via podcasts. So either way, in that case, it obviously worked. Now, if we're talking about Legends of Valhalla in general, I haven't really seen too much gameplay of it. I've seen gameplay in the past as this pinball machine is from Riot Pinball. So it has been around for a little over a year, maybe even two years at this point. So overall, you know, I don't really know what to make of this game. What I do know is that American Pinball has announced that there's 300 Limited Deluxe models out. Now, that being said, it appears that there could possibly be even more at this point. So if we look over at Pennside, there was actually a thread on there. Legends of Valhalla revealed and ready to order with Pinball Star. And that's the thread that we're on. Now, somewhere in here, and I had it up just a second ago, there was another distributor. Yes, it's right here. So Kingpin Games, and this was as of 14 hours ago, they announced, FYI, API has updated the total number of deluxe machines from 300 to 500. It appears that the demand is there for this one. So, you know, for a lot of people, I know that that will anger a lot of people out there. And then, of course, there's going to be some people that won't care either way. Me, personally, I'm one of those that that kind of bothers me a little bit. Because to me, if you're putting out something that's supposed to be limited and people are ordering early on for that particular game based off that model number or that amount of units, I think you should stick to that. So it's kind of a dicey thing. I think we're going to see that play out. I'm going to just go ahead and call this not exactly confirmed just yet because I haven't heard from any other distributors or anything like that that they've heard the same thing. But this is being floated out there. So I'm curious to see exactly what that does with the community and how that galvanizes people, if it does at all, leading up to Expo that comes up this week, as a matter of fact. So moving on and looking through this pin, you know, I don't really know what to make of it. Like I was saying, I haven't seen much gameplay. But in general, in general, I like the idea of new pinball coming out regardless. And, you know, I must admit this layout has me semi-intrigued. Now, it's not exactly a layout that just grabs me immediately like a Godzilla would. But I will say, even in the post-Elwin era, that this layout does look fairly decent compared to other layouts that are out there. Now, if you're seeing this on the video right now, you'll notice that there are three ramps. There's a left ramp, center ramp, and a right ramp that happens to be accessible from the upper flipper So this is a three flipper game That right ramp cannot be hit by any of the lower ramps or by any of the lower flippers but it can be hit by the left upper flipper And it kind of reminds me a little bit of nearly a doctor who type ramp Now the placement isn exact That just kind of what it reminds me of at first glance when I see this. And obviously based off the inserts, there's going to be plenty of modes there. I believe just based off their promo art that they came out with or their promotional stuff, it says that they have 22 total modes. As you can tell right here, we'll zoom in a little bit. 22 total modes, including 16 legend battle modes with five being multiball, six other modes, three of them are multiball, Valhalla wizard mode, and a Ragnarok super wizard mode. So obviously there's going to be lots of modes in there. I don't know how the code's going to be exactly. I don't know exactly how this rule set is really going to fit the way that the layout is. Again, I haven't seen too much of it, so we're all going to learn this all together. Now, looking at the play field features of this game, there's three flippers, six balls, three metal ramps, just like we talked about with wire form returns. So that's kind of important to me. I prefer wire forms over the plastic returns. There's also an interactive Thor's hammer that I believe is located in the back and I think you actually activate that. Now reports have come out from people that have played this on location that they've gone as much as 5, 10, sometimes even 20 games without ever activating it. So I don't know exactly when that comes into play and what all you have to do to make that come into play. But it does clearly say here that that is activated by a third flipper button which makes it come crashing down onto the ball. So it's kind of like your premium le metallica when they had that giant hammer just hitting the ball now i don't know if that means that the ball will just come down through the play field i'm not sure i haven't heard too much about it so it also says it has one spinner one berserker controllable drop target have no idea what that means seven stand-up targets flippers lit with apron lightning special gold reflective apron and over 100 rgb lights so obviously they put in a lot of lights here I believe Godzilla might have somewhere between 13 and 20 RGB lights, if I remember correctly. Apologies if I'm wrong on that. But I know Stern outside of Led Zeppelin, they haven't put in too many lights, RGB style, into their games. So that might give you guys out there a little bit of an indication of how many actual lights are in this game. Now, obviously, it pales in comparison to GNR. But at the same time, Jersey Jack just basically threw every single light known to man into those games. This game also has two spotlights, 12 flashers, a sculpted and hand-painted skull pile, sculpted and hand-painted Odin figure, and special hand-painted shields on ship, plus 500 professional call-outs via Jeff T. Olus. So, big shout-out to Jeff getting on a game that's actually going to get out to people. So, that's awesome. That's going to be super exciting. Excuse me one second.

8:08

See, I knew it was going to happen. I knew I was going to have to clear my sinuses out. All right, so also deluxe edition cabinet features, real mirrored back glass. That's pretty dope. A topper comes with it, a 15.5-inch full-color high-resolution LCD, four stereo speakers plus 8-inch cabinet subwoofer. Now, this one's pretty cool, an epic soundtrack featuring 23 songs from Two Steps of Hell. Now, for those that aren't familiar with what this band is, they've been on some commercials, I believe, and then they also did some of the soundtrack or maybe all the soundtrack for The Hobbit. I forget how much they did on that, but their music is pretty cool, and I think it matches up well for what this theme is. So it also says it's upgraded gold color, powder-coated side rails, back box hinges, lockdown bar and legs, to be expected at this point, shaker motor, knocker, anti-reflective magic play-filled glass. So basically like your HD-type glass. With it, it's going to be 275 pounds on box. So all of this is going to equate to being MSRP is right at $83.95. So you are paying a pretty penny for this. But keep in mind, this is probably the cheapest deluxe or limited edition pinball machine out there, with Spooky obviously being between $9 and $10 when you're all in, with Stern moving up to $10.05, and with Jersey Jack being at $12.05 as of their last game. So all things considered, price-wise, it is still high, but it is lower than all the other competitors. So keep that in mind as well. Now, why that is, I don't know exactly. Obviously, it's part of their strategy, I'd have to assume. And obviously, I think not having this be a licensed theme, I think that that helps them a little bit to keep cost under control. Now, speaking of the theme, and let me go back here to a picture of the game. Speaking of the theme, I personally feel like the theme is the weakest part of the game. Just looking at it and seeing the whole package, I know a lot of people don't really care for the art too much. I okay with it I okay with the art I haven heard call outs yet so I can judge on that I don know too much of the code But just looking at this just knowing what I know right now it appears to me that the theme would have to be the weakest part of the game thus far And so with that being said, this puts us in a weird position because to me, when it comes to pinball, the last thing that you want to be the weakest part of your game is the theme. Now, will that affect them too much? I don't know. obviously from reports saying that they're looking at going up to 500 units instead of 300 obviously they're getting cells that somewhere it's got to be coming in and this day and age with the way pinball is i mean cells they're going to come they're going to keep raining down as of right now we're moving into christmas time we're moving into quarter four i think people are still in a buying mood there's not too many other options out there to buy if you didn't get in on a godzilla LE, you're going to be waiting for a while. If you got in on a Halloween or an Ultraman and you still haven't got your game, you're probably going to be waiting a while. If you got in on a Guns N' Roses from Jersey Jack, you're probably still waiting. I mean, I know people that got it at the very beginning of this year, still haven't got their units yet. I know people that ordered a Mandalorian Premium, still haven't got their units yet. So, again, it could be a lot of combinations of availability and, you know, who knows, maybe there's people out there that dig the theme. I know for me personally, I love Thor from the MCU. If this would have been that, I might have personally had a hard time saying no to it. And I talked to several people that they said if it would have been XYZ theme or whatever type of theme that they like, they might have had a hard time saying no to this. So obviously theme does sell, but you know what? I don't know if that's really American pinball's concern because obviously they're banking on non-licensed themes. And so that's the direction they're going. So kudos to them. I hope it works out. I hope they sell out of everything and I hope they get to keep churning out machines because I think any new pinball is great overall. So what do you guys think about that in general? I know that they are showing it if we go to the schedule events here. I know that, let's see here, October 28th, which I believe is this Thursday as a matter of fact. So at 7 p.m. we can look right here. It's going to be American pinball update and special announcement with speaker david fix so i'm sure we will get all kinds of information coming up about this machine come uh come expo one more second again okay this is horrible this is horrible i don't want a cold anymore of course out of all days i have a cold it's when i choose to record go figure but yeah so 7 p.m thursday night if you're at chicago expo for the pinball expo be sure and stop by and i'm sure you can get all kinds of information when it comes to Legends of Valhalla. But yeah, tell me down in the comments what you guys think about that game. It's pretty interesting to me. I'll be curious to play it. Not necessarily curious enough to buy it right out of the gate, but I did end up getting a Hot Wheels, and I can say that that game was actually enjoyable, and it seems like overall that they're a little bit more ambitious this time around when it comes to overall code and when it comes to the amount of modes that's in. So I'm curious to see how that plays out. Obviously, they got a lot of multi balls built in. I'm curious to see also how that plays out as well. And speaking of Chicago Expo, since we're on this right now, we might as well just talk about the things that you could go check out if you happen to be going to Expo. Now, if you're not going to Expo, but you enjoy watching tournament pinball, be sure and switch it on Twitch. I know that somebody, I forgot who it was is going to be showing the women's tournaments, but I know my buddy Tom Graff from Fox Cities Pinball, he's going to be showing or streaming the main tournament. Now, I'm not sure what dates exactly. I think he might be doing all three days, so probably qualifying the main A Division Finals, then probably Classics, I think, come Sunday, I believe. So yeah, be checking out for that. If you're not going to be there, be looking for that. If you are showing up there, as you can tell here's the schedule of events and we'll go over a few of it right now uh early thursday now if you're there and for whatever reason you get up at 9 30 in the morning good on you but that's when stern pinball is going to do their virtual factory tour and yes i did say tour correctly this time i'm about 75 positive i said it correct but yeah we're going to have that virtual factory tour right there and then let's see 10 a.m obviously the tournaments open up registration opens up. And yeah, let's just keep going down the line here. How to build a pinball machine with Ryan McQuaid and who has done an excellent job with that Sonic pinball machine, by the way. So if you're interested in anything homebrew, I'd probably highly recommend checking that out at 4 p.m. on day one. And I believe Mark Seiden, I hope I got that name correct. I believe that's the newest Jersey Jack pinball designer, actually. And he designed Metroid, I think I'm pronouncing that correctly I think that that the game that he designed also And let see let just keep going down Of course we already talked about 7 p with David Fix 8 p Fireside Chat with Pat Lawler So that could be interesting for some people to check that out Then we move on to day two, which again, let's see, 8.15 in the morning. I don't know. You guys can get up that early while at an expo. More power to you. My butt would be sleeping in, though. And let's see here. What else do we got? Let's see, Keith Holbrook, 11 a.m., Total Pinball Restorations. I think something like that would be pretty cool to listen to as well. I'm very interested in stuff like that. I'm not good at it. We've tried it before. It's insanely tough, but hearing the experts talk about it, that would be something I'd be interested in. Let's see, the best and worst advice seen on the Internet. Don't know what that would be about, but that's at 2 p.m. Let's see, 3 p.m., What's Happening at Chicago Gaming. So that's an interesting time frame to do it, to where you do it in the middle of the afternoon on the second day when Chicago Gaming is coming out with Cactus Canyon at some point. Now, word coming out is that it's very possible that Cactus Canyon will not be at Expo, but hopefully that is wrong. Hopefully it is there and people do get a chance to see the newest game or at least the newest remake in all of its glory and get a chance to flip it. And then moving on, it looks like we have, let's see, later that evening, Gary Stern's introduction to the International Video Hall of Fame with the presenter being Walter Day and that's at 8pm and then 8.45 is an evening with Jersey Jack so you get to speak with Jack himself and staff. Now apologies there again, I'm starting to sniffle one more time. Now I'm not sure if they're going to announce any games at Expo and now of course there's people going back and forth, will they announce their newest game which happens to be based off a Pixar Disney property that I won't name here, but you guys pretty much already know because we've said it before. Now, are they going to announce it at Expo? Personally, I don't think that they would, just because I feel like they still need to get some more games out. And I think kind of distancing themselves from everybody else and doing a similar release as they did with GNR would go a long ways for them. They definitely set the bar on that, and I think if they go that direction again, even if they go even 50% towards that direction, I think that they probably sell out their CEs day one. That would not shock me one bit. I would be very surprised if they chose Expo as a way to show off their game or announce their game ahead of time. Maybe they can just show some sort of teaser. Maybe that might work. I don't know. I wouldn't mind that, but just don't debut the game there. I think that that would be the wrong time, personally. So Saturday continues, and Saturday is basically nearly like a stern day because starting at 3 p.m. after the autograph artist and designer or author, artist, designer autograph session, which starts at 1 p.m. until 2.30 p.m. in the exhibit hall, but starting at 3 p.m. is the making of Led Zeppelin with Tim Sexton. And literally from 3 p.m. all the way through, it looks like possibly 9 or 10 p.m., it's just all stern. I mean, we've got the making of Led Zeppelin. You've got Jack Danger and Wason talking about Jurassic Park the Pen. You've got, let's see, at 5, you have The Making of the Mandalorian with Brian Eddy and Dwight Sullivan. At 6, you've got George Gomez's new project. Now, I have to assume that they're talking about the Insider Connected, in which case he's already been out there talking about it a lot, but any other additional information you could get, that might be a good time to get it. Then, of course, Keith Elwin and his team is going to be talking about Godzilla at 7 p.m., And then the evening appears to be coming to an end with Family Feud without the family with Dwight Sullivan. So there you go. That's everything that you could do at Expo. Check it out. It's great if you guys get there. I personally, I'm not going to be able to be there this year. I was planning on going, but at the last second, I'm not going to be able to go. But I really wish I could have. It looks like a lot of fun. I'm sure everybody else out there, though, will be having a lot of fun. and hopefully you guys get plenty of pinball in. I know Stern Pinball is going to have all their games out there with a lot of them having the Insider connected, so you'll be able to test out games other than just Godzilla and see how many achievements you can get. So, yeah, there you go. You get to see Legends of Valhalla. You may or may not get to see the next Jersey Jack pin. You may or may not get to see the next Chicago Gaming pin. Most likely you'll get chances to play Halloween and what's the other game? Ultraman while you're there. and then you'll also get to see I don't know like Godzilla you get to hear speakers you get to do everything it sounds like a great time but other than that that's all I got appreciate you guys listening appreciate you guys watching you guys have a great day and I'll see you guys soon later guys you have just listened to a pinball podcast you can catch new shows on your favorite podcatcher or over on youtube.com forward slash marvloco for even more pinball content