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The Pinball Show Ep 11: We Are The Truth-Seekers

The Pinball Show·podcast_episode·1h 36m·analyzed·Apr 27, 2020
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claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.035

TL;DR

TMNT teased at Stern; American Pinball pivots Hot Wheels to location market; Butch Peel departs Jersey Jack.

Summary

The Pinball Show episode 11 features news segments on Jersey Jack Pinball losing tech specialist Butch Peel, American Pinball's Hot Wheels direction targeting locations over collectors, and speculation about Stern's next release being Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles based on a leaked TMNT logo visible in Dwight Sullivan's Zoom background. Hosts Zach Minney and Dennis Creasel discuss how IP licensing, art direction, and location vs. collector market positioning affect game design and sales potential.

Key Claims

  • Butch Peel, Jersey Jack Pinball's tech support specialist and manual writer, is no longer with the company

    high confidence · Ken Rudberg's Jersey Jack update segment cites Canadian Pinball Podcast as first report; Butch known for technical manuals, video deep dives, and customer support.

  • A reddish-pink TMNT logo was visible in the background of Dwight Sullivan's Zoom call during Stern's internal design meeting

    medium confidence · Craig Bobby's Stern correspondent segment; speculation that this hints at Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles as Stern's next release with Dwight Sullivan on code.

  • American Pinball's Hot Wheels is being designed primarily for location/operator markets rather than home collectors

    high confidence · Joe Balzer (American Pinball designer) and Josh Kugler (coder) stated this explicitly in Super Awesome Pinball Show interview; game features lower price point and packed ruleset suited to operator needs.

  • Jeff Bush, the artist on Hot Wheels, is working as a contract employee rather than full-time at American Pinball

    high confidence · Stated in Super Awesome Pinball Show interview; hosts note Mattel imposed strict style guide requirements on Bush's artwork.

  • Stern's George Gomez strategically allowed the TMNT logo to be visible in the Zoom screenshot, with easy opportunity to crop or reframe it

    medium confidence · Zach and Dennis speculate that Stern had 16 screenshots to choose from and could have easily adjusted framing; suggests intentional teaser marketing.

  • Roger Sharp is helping American Pinball with Hot Wheels licensing

    medium confidence · Mentioned in Super Awesome Pinball Show interview; Zach notes this was not previously public knowledge.

  • American Pinball chose the newer Hot Wheels YouTube series as the story/theme basis rather than classic toy nostalgia

    high confidence · Super Awesome Pinball Show interview; American Pinball consulted with Mattel and licensed the use of the YouTube series storyline.

Notable Quotes

  • “I sit at home, Dennis, late into the night, drunk off of Pepsi, listening to Roy Orbison and thinking about you. Crying over you.”

    Zach Minney @ ~05:30 — Light comedic segment referencing Dennis's absence due to COVID; illustrates the casual, joking tone between co-hosts.

  • “I do think it's just part of that standard ramp up that we see when Stern gets ready to launch the teaser trailer. I think they tend to let little things for the fans slip out unofficially, officially.”

    Zach Minney @ ~35:20 — Interpretation of Stern's marketing strategy; suggests intentional Easter egg seeding before major announcements.

  • “As a distributor I sure as hell hope it is because if I've got a killer license like that and theme I've got Dwight Sullivan code I've got the rumors John Borg doing layout the rumors Zombie Yeti doing art packages we know that at this point in time Zombie Yeti artwork sells pinball machines so as a distributor I'm looking forward to this.”

    Zach Minney @ ~40:00 — Zach articulates the distributor perspective on TMNT; emphasizes importance of designer/artist combinations (Sullivan, Borg, Yeti) in driving sales.

  • “Most of the things that we do nostalgic, aside from bands where you're in love with the songs and the memories those evoke, is you're remembering characters and stories and that is what the licenses appeal to.”

    Dennis Creasel @ ~65:00 — Core argument about why Hot Wheels lacks narrative appeal compared to Turtles/Ghostbusters; frames design philosophy around IP storytelling.

  • “They lowered the bomb on it. They lowered the pricing on it. Joe Balzer said he loves packing and filling out games. That's one of his favorite things to do.”

    Zach Minney @ ~70:00 — Explains American Pinball's strategic shift: lower price point, location-focused marketing, contrasts with collector-premium positioning.

  • “By collector standards American Pinball machines are built really well and they're actually really packed and they bring a lot of beauty they bring a lot but it's always just the theme so maybe continue to up the bomb continue to fill out these games and to be competitive with a Stern Premium.”

Entities

Butch PeelpersonJersey Jack PinballcompanyDwight SullivanpersonTeenage Mutant Ninja TurtlesgameGeorge GomezpersonAmerican Pinballcompany

Signals

  • ?

    community_signal: Stern Stranger Things hype damaged by COVID-related production shutdown delaying game availability

    medium · Zach argues 'hype wanes in this hobby' and people who would have bought Stranger Things 'will not and they'll just wait for the next game'; notes operators report strong location performance despite delay.

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Beatles pinball design choice between Ed Sullivan early-era vs. Yellow Submarine aesthetic debated by hosts

    medium · Chris Franchi confirmed design team had deliberate choice; hosts discuss trade-offs between art safety (Ed Sullivan) vs. music/era preference (Yellow Submarine); both agree Ed Sullivan was 'safer pick.'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Hot Wheels YouTube series chosen to provide narrative/story element lacking in classic toy-only nostalgia

    high · American Pinball consulted with Mattel on story approach; chose newer YouTube series for 'catchy, funny, entertaining' storyline to compensate for toy line's lack of narrative.

  • ?

    leak_detection: TMNT logo visible in background of Dwight Sullivan's Zoom call during Stern design meeting

    medium · Craig Bobby reports 'reddish-pink pinball trans light' and 'radioactive tee from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles logo' visible in corner of screenshot; hosts debate whether this was intentional teaser.

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Mattel imposed strict art style guide on Hot Wheels pinball artwork; artist received kickbacks for deviations

    high · Dennis reports 'they were getting kicked back sometimes like oh I'm not sure that this fantasy car would do that or this angle'; describes Mattel as 'very very particular about the artwork.'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.290

0:00
The Pinball Network is online. Launching The Pinball Show. Pinball is a game of skill. For some, it's a passion and a lifestyle.
0:20
It's time for The Pinball Show. It's pinball with personality. Welcome back to the Pinball Show. We're in episode 11. We are your hosts, Zach Minney and my buddy, Dennis Creasel from the Eclectic Gamers Podcast. How the hell are you been? I'm great, Zach. How have you been? Are you ready for an exciting week of pinball news and drama?
0:46
Are you ready, Zach? Isn't this what you want? Have you caught an illness? You sound too chipper. No, we're recording so late in the morning. I'm awake now. Oh, I see what you did there. look i'm i run a little behind every single episode every single and i let you pick the time i let you pick and then i let you push it back even further i know and then you're still late and i was i was gonna be five minutes late and i was like oh gosh i'm gonna hear that but this is what zach i'm not gonna know i'm not in my chair until 9 35 yeah listener know that every single week I ask and request an extension for the start time. Dennis becomes perturbed but still lets it go. And it's probably why we're down to two founders of the Pinball Network.
1:34
I'm a planner, Zach. I just like to follow the plan. I'm a builder. I'm a creator. And it's hard for me to stop creating to record. I want to include it all. Well, me and my time are not your clay. Oh. Can I mold you? it's not ghost i'm not you're not my whoopie would i be the whoopie or would i be the demi more you're you can maybe you're you are the pot that is being made oh no is it a vase i don't know yeah it was like a vase do you say vase or vase uh a vase is a vase that costs over a thousand I was going to ask, is it pretentious to say Voss and you just answered it? It is, but I think you can do it as long as it costs a lot. I think it becomes a Voss. I think the difference between Chase and Chaz. Right, well, it's like caramel versus caramel. Oh, watch out there. There's some fights that have brewed because of that argument. Do you say caramel or caramel? I usually say caramel. I do too. Caramel. Nah, sometimes. Like caramel corn. Depends on what party I'm with, I suppose. I say thrice. Do you say thrice?

Location-based pinball will be significantly degraded for at least another 12 months due to COVID-19 pandemic impacts

low confidence · Dennis references Pinside operator thread discussing reopening logistics (sterilization, social distancing, game placement); speculation on impact to location game sales.

  • Beatles pinball was given a choice between Ed Sullivan early-era theming and Yellow Submarine theming

    medium confidence · Chris Franchi (Beatles pin artist) stated this in Super Awesome Pinball Show; design team chose Ed Sullivan aesthetic.

    • Dennis Creasel @ ~75:30 — Diagnosis of American Pinball's collector market problem: quality is good, but IP licensing choices are weak; recommends staying premium-tier rather than moving downmarket.

  • “I think you're – I would just keep the bomb. My recommendation to him would have been keep the bomb the same as you have been for Oktoberfest and Houdini and get a license and not this one. Like a real one.”

    Dennis Creasel @ ~78:00 — Direct criticism of Hot Wheels IP choice; suggests American Pinball should pursue stronger licensed IP rather than pivoting to location market.

  • “I didn't know if that was a publicly known thing about Roger Sharp helping with the licensing. I hadn't heard it before.”

    Dennis Creasel @ ~58:00 — Notes Roger Sharp's involvement in Hot Wheels licensing was not previously public; signals new information about licensing contracting.

  • “The only draw for me is the music. I like the earlier Beatles stuff. I do like the Yellow Submarine era of Beatles music. So that's a tough one for me.”

    Zach Minney @ ~50:00 — Illustrates tension between art aesthetic (Ed Sullivan) and music/era choices (Yellow Submarine); shows design trade-offs in licensed IP.

  • “They were discussing like – they were getting kicked back sometimes like, oh, I'm not sure that this fantasy car would do that or this angle. I'm not sure it's been at this angle before. That sounds pretty picky.”

    Dennis Creasel @ ~62:00 — Describes Mattel's strict IP control over Hot Wheels artwork; illustrates licensing constraints on artistic freedom.

    • Hot Wheels
    game
    Joe Balzerperson
    Josh Kuglerperson
    Jeff Bushperson
    Roger Sharpperson
    Chris Franchiperson
    Beatles Pinballgame
    Stranger Thingsgame
    Zombie Yetiperson
    John Borgperson
    Zach Minneyperson
    Dennis Creaselperson
    Super Awesome Pinball Showmedia
    Mattelcompany
    Rick and Mortygame
    Spooky Pinballcompany
    Canadian Pinball Podcastmedia
  • $

    market_signal: COVID-19 pandemic severely constraining location-based pinball market for estimated 12+ months

    medium · Dennis references Pinside operator thread discussing reopening logistics (sterilization, social distancing, game placement); states 'location pinball is probably significantly degraded for at least another 12 months.'

  • $

    market_signal: Stern strategically allowed TMNT logo to remain visible in official Zoom screenshot with opportunity to crop/reframe

    medium · Zach argues 'they could have cropped or just said we're not doing that shot' and 'would have been easy for them to adjust'; interprets as deliberate Easter egg seeding before formal announcement.

  • ?

    community_signal: TMNT rumored designer/coder team includes Dwight Sullivan (code), John Borg (layout), Zombie Yeti (art)

    medium · Zach speculates this combo of 'Dwight Sullivan code, John Borg doing layout, Zombie Yeti doing art packages' would drive sales; credits Yeti's art as key sales driver.

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Butch Peel departs Jersey Jack Pinball after long tenure

    high · Ken Rudberg reports Butch Peel 'no longer with Jersey Jack Pinball' per Canadian Pinball Podcast; known for manuals, video deep dives, customer support, and show appearances.

  • ?

    product_strategy: American Pinball confirms code updates for Oktoberfest and Houdini coming soon; Hot Wheels in final programming stage

    high · Ken/Brian Costner reports code updates 'will be available very soon'; Josh Kugler and Joe Schober finishing Hot Wheels code; Joe working on game four (rumored Sherlock Holmes, Poker Run, Robin Hood, or Valkyries).

  • ?

    business_signal: American Pinball pivoting Hot Wheels toward location/operator market rather than home collectors

    high · Joe Balzer stated game 'aim was actually for locations entertainment centers etc and not so much the collectors'; lowered price point; packed gameplay for venue use.

    • 2:45
    I have. I can't say I use it the majority of the time. I'm talking about three things. You know, I don't know how to say the use of nor. I don't know how to use nor. Neither, nor, either, or, neither, nor. I used it, and then in my dissertation, they were like, no, get rid of nor. And I'm like, well, nor is a word. Well, I think the problem with thinking neither, nor, that's like a double negative. You could just use nor if you're saying that tooth. Like, I didn't go to the store nor to the theater. I didn't go to either place. But you can still say or there too, right? You could, which is probably why they told you to get out of your other thesis. I know, right? And then they switched my also. You know the use of the word also often, for the majority of people, they use it incorrectly. The where it's planted into the sentence also goes before anything. Well, I struggle with language. So, no, I probably don't know most of these things. I'm amazed I can speak. Also in news, what have you been up to lately? COVID. Oh, God, still this COVID. I feel like my bromance, my man crush, Dennis Creasel, is being pulled away from me by this nasty virus. Well, everyone's been pretty disrupted by it in varying degrees, so that should probably feel true for just about every relationship you have. I sit at home, Dennis, late into the night, drunk off of Pepsi, listening to Roy Orbison and thinking about you.
    4:18
    Crying over you. That's such a good song. I'm crying over you, Dennis. I'm concerned about the level of singing that I think has been exponentially increasing as more and more people have left TPN. Oh, you think there's a correlation there? It seems like there's a mathematical equation to it. Well, yeah. It's not exponential, but there's something going on. I got your polynomial right here. You ready to talk some pinball news?
    4:49
    What news? Go ahead. Let's turn it over to our TPN correspondents for this week's lineup of pinball news. Let's do it. I was way too enthused. Holy shit. Don't keep that in. Cut that out. It's time for TPN Industry News. Hi, this is Ken Rudberg with your Jersey Jack update. Butch Peel, pinball tech and customer support person, is no longer with Jersey Jack Pinball, as first reported by Canada's Pinball Podcast. Butch has been with Jack since the beginning, and he's known for his well-written manuals, which are some of the best in the industry, video deep dives into Jersey Jack games that detail the engineering behind the machines, and most of all for his technical skills and great customer support. Butch has also traveled to many shows over the years, meeting Jersey Jack customers, performing seminars, and generally talking pinball. There are many stories posted on Pinside about how Butch went above and beyond to help customers with their technical issues. It's clear that he'll be missed. Jersey Jack continues to work on its new facility, and it's ready to start rolling as soon as Illinois relaxes its stay-at-home orders. For the Pinball Show, this has been Ken Rudberg with your Jersey Jack update.
    6:12
    Hey, this is Kaz with an American Pinball update. With manufacturing still shut down, work continues on the programming side, as code updates for Oktoberfest and Houdini will be available very soon. And on the latest super awesome Pinball Show, the guys interviewed Josh Kugler and Joe Balser. It was a great interview. If you haven't heard it, go check that out. Josh, along with Joe Schober, is finishing up code for Hot Wheels, while Joe is working on game number four. Will it be one of the rumored titles of Sherlock Holmes, Poker Run, Robin Hood, Valkyries? Hopefully, manufacturing will begin very soon, so that Hot Wheels will be rolling off the assembly line. For the Pinball Show, this is Brian Costner.
    6:54
    The Stern rumor mill comes out of quarantine. Hey everyone, Craig here again, the pinball show's Stern News Correspondent. Well, rumors galore this week as pent-up pinheads scour the interwebs in search of nuggets of pinball news in a world dominated by paralyzing pandemic headlines. So before you head out for your daily family outing to the local McDonald's drive-thru, this just in, courtesy of Zach Mennie's homie-gomie, Stern's George Gomez, as pinball executive, designer, and renaissance man extraordinaire gave starving pinheads everywhere a little Easter egg this past week. That's right, shortly after a Zoom meeting with Stern's internal design team this past Tuesday, George posted a screen grab on Facebook showing images of the 16 employees who are all hard at work and on the video call. Who else can be seen on the call? Well, none other than Stern's lead developer, Dwight Sullivan, who, if you look closely at his headshot, can be seen with what looks like a tiny sliver of a yet unconfirmed reddish-pink pinball trans light in the background, barely showing the green radioactive tee from, yes, you guessed it, the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles logo. Pow! Mind blown! And if that wasn't enough to get your pinball juices flowing, there were new Lord of the Ring vault rumors this week, courtesy of Canada's Pinball Podcast and Lior Rajwan, pinball modder, artist and designer extraordinaire, via Lior's Instagram page. Both TMNT and LOTR photos touched off waves of pin side and podcast pontificating that either title could be first up on the Stern post-pandemic production line. But we shall wait and see. For the Pinball Show, I'm Craig Bobby. Catch you on the flip side.
    8:51
    Always great to hear from the correspondents. Let's dive into a, oh yeah, that's right, you hear the music, a little Turtle Gate 2020.
    9:01
    Would you hide in a shell, Dennis? In a half shell. Turtle power, man. Did you grow up with turtles? Uh, yeah. Yeah, you're a bit. Yeah, I remember the early video games, watched the cartoon. I didn't read the comics I didn't know there were comics for years and years not until I was all grown up and I've never read them but I guess it started as a spoof we heard our own stern correspondent Craig Bobby I love Craig Bobby's segments I know you do is it just me Zach or is he becoming more Craig Bobby every correspondent recording he's becoming more Craig-y yes more Craig-y if you were part of the world of turtle power do you think you'd be splinter would you be shredder you'd be crane wouldn't you no no maybe bebop really you're not probably not with jazz music maybe i'd be the ooze if you were the if you were a ninja turtle you'd be donatello correct i mean that's factually you picked the nerdy one well when i was a kid my favorite was rafael He didn't play by the rules. Yeah. They all like pizza. Anchovies on their pizza. You're probably similar in that regard. But Michelangelo I never liked. He's so obnoxious. Really? I really kind of... Oh, you identify with the circle. Yeah, I kind of identified with him. Yeah, big shock. Yeah. Not really a Raphael kind of guy. Maybe a little Leonardo.
    10:31
    I don't know. Possibly. The burdens of leadership are overrated. So Stern recently did, I guess, a Zoom meeting. and we see the corner of what appears to be a graphic for Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles in the background of Dwight Sullivan's, look like, basement. So you've seen his basement before. You're acquainted with the basement stylings of Mr. Sullivan. Well, I mean, last time I was there, there was a basket lower down and all I hear was, it puts lotion on his... I was like, Dwight! Yes, it puts lotion on its skin or else it gets my light show. Oh, God.
    11:10
    Just because I don't like Game of Thrones doesn't mean I don't love Star Wars. Come on, Dwight. Let me up.
    11:17
    No, but we saw that. Was it a poster? Was it the head of a back box? It kind of looked like a poster to me. Yeah, me too. You know, it was only a corner. And, you know, Stern historically has been pretty strategic with releasing images that let you kind of see stuff. So do you think this was strategic?
    11:35
    I do. Okay. I do. Okay. It's one screenshot of 16 that they had every opportunity to review and decide. They could have cropped or just said, we're not doing that shot, or we're going to take a photo. Hey, Dwight, can you reach up and tap your webcam over half an inch to the right so that it comes out on the – off of the – it depends if it was in mirror mode or not. But it would have been easy. It would have been easy for them to adjust from that. Do you think this then infers that they are making a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pinball machine? Yes. Okay. Surprising no one. Okay. All right. And he would, I guess, I assume he'd be doing code. I think it's part of, yeah, I do. And I think it's just part of that standard ramp up that we see when Stern gets ready to launch the teaser trailer. I think they tend to let little things for the fans slip out unofficially, officially. Do you think this is a good marketing strategy?
    12:33
    I think it's irrelevant. Really? Because I think everyone who this is targeted to already knows that Turtles is coming. That's a fair point. I could see this. I've still seen comments online of shock. I've still seen individuals who follow pinball that, oh, Dwight's doing the code. Oh, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. I was also very surprised by a lot of people not being that excited about the license. I thought it was kind of a dynamite license if it is rumored to be true, especially if it is the nostalgia of the 80s, 90s Turtles. I don't know what to make of this. It didn't look like a back box to me. If I'm going to nerd out for you listeners, it can't be a back box aside of a back box because the placement of the T-U scale-wise would not even come close to even getting the second T on a back box. So it wasn't that.
    13:28
    Maybe, if it is true that they are doing turtles, maybe it was just the stern banner that they do. I love those stern banners. Maybe it was just that. Oh, okay. Yeah, I could. I've never really looked at the banners much, so. I love them. I'll send you one. No, I don't. Where would I put it? By your neon. nothing goes nothing goes by the neon zach nothing goes by the neon there's no room but there's windows there after you don't want me to block my window actually i need some shades or something there you go we'll get some stern banners to block the get me some stern venetian blind size for those little dinky burglar sized windows a burglar sized well because the burglar or burglars came through one of them i still love that name all right so we we get a hint maybe possibly about a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. There's also in the background another machine they were working on that people were speculating maybe was the heavy metal. It looked odd. The display looked, I don't know, it looked like a test setup to me, so I'm not making much of that.
    14:30
    I think that Stern's next release game, we would have seen it by now had it not been for all this COVID stuff. So they are probably primed for their next game, if I had to guess, and maybe it is Turtles. maybe it is as a distributor i sure as hell hope it is because if i've got a killer license like that and theme i've got dwight sullivan code i've got the rumors john borg doing layout the rumors zombie yeti doing art packages we know that at this point in time zombie yeti artwork sells pinball machines so as a distributor i'm looking forward to this as a collector i'm looking forward to this. I can't think of anything bad. Some of my favorite games ever made by Stern Pinball are coded by Dwight Sullivan. So this makes me happy. Do you think that this purported Yeti-Borg-Sullivan combo with a Turtles license gives more sales than Stranger Things? Well, that's, I don't know. That's why I'm asking for speculation. At this point in the Stranger things pre-reveal i think the hype was really strong because we were hearing rumors of stranger things killer license brian eddy's return killer designer once he got up his sleeve we didn't know much about any artist or coder or anything we thought if brian eddy was involved he would be working on some of the coding aspects as he's done in the past at bally williams so i would say it's probably similar i don't think so but that's not all stranger things fault i think that the problem has been again because of the shutdown and everything uh you know how hype wanes in this hobby i think there were people that would have probably bought a stranger things who have not and now will not and they'll just wait for the next game and that could help turtles out in terms of turtle sales but it may end up meaning stranger things as ends up performing less well than stern thought it would even though i could see that it was a kill i've heard really good things about uh operators noting how it was performing on location i've heard that as well with all this information about i don't know if you've watched any there's a thread on pin side uh where arcade operators are talking about next steps on reopening it's bleak yeah it's not like they're talking about six foot distances and you know games are usually in rows and how are they going to sterilize and are they going to let people put cleaners on the games and if not then the facility has to it's like location pinball is probably significantly degraded for at least another 12 months that's my guess i don't i don't that hurts that hurts stranger things i think it's a good argument to make you guys can also go listen to the most recent podcast by loser kid pinball podcast they had roger sharp on and if anybody has some prognostication powers it's that man and he had some of the same sentiments uh when he was discussing it with the guy i only just started the first episode of that today when I was getting groceries. So I'm not that far along yet to hear his prognostications. Yeah, so we'll hear, we'll probably hear a lot of home sales going forward, maybe an increased focus on home sales and marketing of some of these manufacturers. As Craig Bobby always says, we'll just have to wait and see. Now, you didn't have to wait and see. You could stop, sit, and listen to the Super Awesome Pinball Show with hosts Christopher for Franchi, Ed Van Der Veen, and Dr. Christian Line. On their most recent podcast, there was some nuggets in there that I thought are worth repeating here. Chris Franchi, the artist of the Beatles pinball machine by Kapow and Stern Pinball Collaboration a year and a half or so ago, said that the Beatles pin was actually a choice that they had to make. It wasn't this Ed Sullivan-only theming. They had the choice, Dennis, to make a yellow submarine rendition instead of that old 64 Ed Sullivan early Beatles. Do you think they made the right decision? I mean, hindsight's 20-20, but do you think they made the right decision?
    18:42
    It's a tough one. It is. because I thought that other than I was never a huge fan of the Beatles color scheme but the art on it looks good. It's gorgeous. I know some people really think Yellow Submarine is a better look but I always just associate with the cartoon. I mean I want to pick because I don't want to seem like I'm hedging so I guess I'll say yeah I think Ed Sullivan was probably the right answer I think it was the safer pick I don't think it's polarizing to go with Ed Sullivan Beatles and perhaps you would have polarized a little bit with yellow submarine uh what songs end up in the game i think was actually more important than which era of art you went with and that might hedge towards yellow submarine and it could it could but again i think people are more like you know strawberry fields forever or some of the really late stuff where they got very technical on what they were like at the time i believe uh with strawberry fields for example That was like the full capabilities of what could be done in a studio technologically. They got a little acidy. Yeah, and that's where the controversy comes in as well. So yeah, I think Ed Sullivan was the right play with that. It was a limited run. So it's not like, oh, but they could have sold 2,000 yellow. No, they weren't going to sell 2,000 of anything. They chose not to. So in a way, yeah. I agree with you. I think that this was the right choice selfishly as a hobbyist. I think it represented the brand better. The only draw for me is the music. I like the earlier Beatles stuff. I do like the Yellow Submarine era of Beatles music. So that's a tough one for me. But the art, the different colors that could be utilized, and if you're doing, if they were stuck on doing that Sea Witch layout, which I believe they probably would be prior to picking the type of theme within the theme, I think the Ed Sullivan and early Beatles better matches with that style of playing field and rules, etc. Yeah, no, I think that the era went very well with that sea witch style layout. And at this point, in one of those instances where maybe the art got a lot of initial attention, but I think most of the desire around Beatles now is actually around the design. So, the design of the game at this stage. So terrifically designed. The Super Awesome Pinball Show also interviewed Joe Hallow, balser designer over at American Pinball, as well as coder Josh J. Coog Coogler. Now, those nicknames, pet names, those are mine, Dennis. Sorry about that. What a shock. American Pinball, apparently, I didn't know this was public, but the guys over there at American Pinball said that they implied that Roger Sharp was helping with the licensing of Hot Wheels, the upcoming third game by American Pinball. Not surprising. Roger contracts out and jumps here and there, but I didn't know if that was a publicly known thing about Roger Sharp helping with the licensing. I hadn't heard it before. Yeah. American Pinball also chose the Hot Wheels YouTube series as the storyline. That was somewhat surprising. They were talking about... I already knew that. Okay. They were talking about the content of what story are we going to tell, what is going to transpire in this pinball machine, how are we going to represent the Hot Wheels brand, license, environment, world, etc. And they stumbled across the newer YouTube series of Hot Wheels, and they thought it was catchy. They thought it was funny. They thought it was entertaining. So they asked Hot Wheels if they could utilize that series, and they said, yeah, roll with that. So they rolled with that, and you're going to hear a lot of the storyline of the new Hot Wheels pinball machine based on that YouTube series. Hmm. Now, I don't – I'll have to play the game. Either it was a really good idea or just not so good of an idea. You mean the YouTube aspect? Well, my biggest concern when I heard about Hot Wheels as the next rumored title was, on the nostalgia front, the problem I have with Hot Wheels is there's no story to it. It's not like Turtles or Ghostbusters or anything. Most of the things that we do nostalgic, aside from bands where you're in love with the songs and the memories those evoke, is you're remembering characters and stories and that is what the licenses appeal to. That's why people want another Back to the Future. That's why they want another Turtles is they're in love with the story. There's no story in Hot Wheels. But going with the YouTube series gives them a story. so I think it put they need a storyline it can't just be go around and drive a bunch of cars otherwise it's Mustang well but I think this is a great shooter and good rules but there ain't no story there I think ACDC did fine I think Metallica did fine I said music pins were an exception because you have your own memories your own storyline that are evoked when you hear songs from the past well then you could argue that you have your own memories evoked from Hot Wheels the Cars you could argue that but it's not remotely the same. You may argue it, but people don feel it like me When people say He I think of the cartoon I don think about the experience I had playing with my He toys in the yard and then my dog took and ate them
    24:15
    I think you're – That's like third or fourth in the list. I think your argument was stronger before you made that point. No, no. It's not. I'm not going to argue it though because I think you're right. Me as kid play with toys. If that's the case, then Tonka dump trucks should be like this kid-ass theme. That's right. Because I played the hell with my dump trucks. Yeah, but the difference being He-Man has a character that you can identify with. Yeah, yeah, but it's the show that – Yeah, that's right. And that's whatever it's like. Oh, yeah, it's got to be about the show. It can't be about the toy. It's got to be about the show. And all we who grew up with Hot Wheels back in yesteryear had were the toys. But that they have a story now puts the – I think it puts it in a stronger position. The only issue would be whether or not the YouTube series is popular. because if their plan is to get this on a route and people know that series it's going to help it's not going to help someone like me because i have no nostalgia to the story it's too new it's just too new so uh dialed in had a story too yeah but we didn't have any uh touchstone experience as kids to it no or as adults similar you can do modern stuff like game of thrones hit show people are like oh i love the characters i love the story i love the arcs that's why some people were drawn to game of thrones even with the art package it had and that's some of the criticisms we hear about jurassic park you get the main music you get the dinosaurs but you don't get that story that you're so used to that you grew up with yeah talking about art on hot wheels the fellas said that jeff bush uh he was the artist on this as he was with houdini and Oktoberfest. Former Sega artist, isn't he? Ooh, I think you're right. I think he was with Sega. Yeah, he's done some work in the past in pinball. I know that, and I think you're right. But he is no longer a full-time employee at American Pinball. He's rather a contract employee. They said it just makes more sense because of the timetable on these releases. You don't need a full-time artist. but they said that Mattel was very, very particular about the artwork, and rightfully so. Jeff Bush attempted to use a style guide or the style guide given to him and stay true to the intellectual property of Mattel's Hot Wheels. That's scary to hear. What part? The style guide or that he's a contractor? The style guide and, no, I think the contract. Look, that's what everybody does for their artists. Yeah, yeah, that's – I mean, that's Zombie Yeti. That's Franchi. That's Donnie. That's everybody. But the style guide worries me in trying to stay true to the IP. Why does the style guide – of course they had a style guide. It's Hot Wheels. It's got to look like Hot Wheels. They were discussing like – they were getting kicked back sometimes like, oh, I'm not sure that this fantasy car would do that or this angle. I'm not sure it's been at this angle before. That sounds pretty picky. I'm just afraid he goes too – I've not heard this episode yet. I'm afraid he goes too safe. I don't know. But I will say that the art looks pretty good. Art looks pretty good. I thought it looked fine. It's colorful. It looks good. Yeah, I thought it looked like Hot Wheels. And again, it's not like there's a story with a bunch of characters. Does it scream? That doesn't look at all like Bill Murray. Bill Murray isn't the Hot Wheels Phantom. Does it scream award-winning art? I need to take another look, but probably not. Probably not. They also talked about the aim of Hot Wheels being for locations, operators, entertainment centers. This comes as no surprise to people like us, Dennis, because we've been talking about this. They lowered the bomb on it. They lowered the pricing on it. Joe Balzer said he loves packing and filling out games. That's one of his favorite things to do. And history supports his desire to do that because he has some very packed games. Think of Wizard of Oz, thinking of the Simpsons pinball party. He packs games down, even Oktoberfest. Houdini, he packs them down. But he said this one, their aim was actually for locations, entertainment centers, etc., and not so much the collectors. Not that they don't want the collectors playing them and buying them. Does that worry you at all as a collector, as a player? As a collector, I mean, I'm not the target market for them anyway. so in that front no it doesn't unfortunately with the covid stuff yeah bad timing that had that not been in play i think this was the right move for them because they clearly are not penetrating the collector market well enough so they need to change something but maybe that strategy would have been to change the games but still target the collectors because i think that's the deeper market but uh i think that it makes sense for them to go ahead and try and do something more location friendly because if they ain't moving a thousand units to the collectors they got to try something else yeah but one could argue and i think that's the argument i would make that maybe they're not tapping into that collector market as strongly as they they would like to not because of pricing or not it's because of theming maybe you change the theme around i think by collector standards american pinball machines are built really well and they're actually really packed and they bring a lot of beauty they bring a lot but it's always just the theme so maybe continue to up the bomb continue to fill out these games and to be competitive with a stern premium and just pick a licensed theme that everybody likes i do agree with you that i think the reason why they've primarily struggled in the home market has been the license picks i don't think that the best answer is for them to increase the bomb and then start moving into the j i i just think that's so crowded okay you're asking them to go against stern premium and jjps and i mean there's not a lot of oxygen that high up yeah and i'm really quite and now the way it sounds and i obviously i could be wrong but it sounds to me like deep root is also you know arguing value but seems to be arguing value from the point of the premium yeah it's like y'all are fighting for the same piece of pie and that pie is not remotely near 100 of this market yeah and okay good luck but you're going to be compared you're going to be compared to things like uh pirates of the caribbean You're going to have Oktoberfest against Pirates of the Caribbean. And I don't know if that's a battle that this company is equipped to fight. Yeah, I think you – I would just keep the bomb. My recommendation to him, Zach, would have been keep the bomb the same as you have been for Oktoberfest and Houdini and get a license and not this one. Like a real one. You're right. You're right in this situation. With a story. Yeah, because if they are meddling with these unlicensed themes or these – I'm going to call them intellectual properties themes that are light. Hot Wheels feels a bit light.
    31:09
    I was so surprised at it for their first license. Obviously, different things, the cost of the license is going to depend on the popularity of the property. But look at how well Rick and Morty did for Spooky with the 750 units. And what all sorts of stuff that's kind of in this just, you know, totally cribbing from them. Other stuff in that weird space, like Aqua Teen Hunger Force and stuff. I mean, there's just like all the I mean, that wouldn't attract me. Still stronger than Hot Wheels. I think right now in 2020, even if Aqua Teen is not, that's dated at this point. It's still a little bit stronger and edgier. But so, yeah, I think you're right. So I could have seen I totally would have seen them going for something dated because it would have been affordable. but something where people like oh yeah i remember watching that in college and there's a there's something there i still don't understand the fact that if you're going to work with mattel at least come out and tell us he man is unattainable don't work with mattel and give us hot wheels over he man mind is blown like at least come and tell us no it's apples and oranges you guys that would make me feel better because i don't sure sure are you there and there's so many 80s cartoons yes obviously like he-man we talked about inspector gai joe 90s um 90s duck tales oh i would love a duck tales i thought about you animaniacs pinky in the brain that's me and you i actually never watched that show uh no the side note have you ever seen that custom done duck tales arcade stand-up no based on the i think this NES or Super NES game. It was a custom done one that this guy was he did that. He did Legend of Zelda from the NES game and he built like an upright arcade. If anybody knows how I can get my hands, I think there was three of those DuckTales made, how I can get my hands on one of those, please do. Not that I want arcade games, but I want that arcade game. So if you can build one just like the one he built or you have access to one of the ones, please let me know. Or hell, I'll contract them out. I want that damn thing. God, so pretty. Listeners, if you haven't seen that, type in like custom DuckTales Arcade.
    33:27
    Type in woohoo. Woohoo. Find it. Also talking about Hot Wheels here, they said that there is this new click lock system they're using that you can actually swap the cars on your Hot Wheels. So for some collectors out there, they might want to use their own cars or showcase their own cars in the game. So they have this click lock system that allows the owner to do that or the operator to do that. I think that it was a really clever and good idea. That's accommodating to collectors because locations aren't going to care about that. No, I think that was really cool because some of these collectors are really diehard. Ooh, they are diehard about these Hot Wheels. More like diecast. Oh!
    34:08
    That's why he's the best, ladies and gentlemen. And to end out the discussion, Josh Kugler was talking about Houdini. and he said that there's actually a cheat code on Houdini that you can get to the Master Magician, the final wizard mode on Houdini, and that beta coders or beta testers have a clue already as to how to access it, but he doesn't know of anybody that has done it yet. A cheat code. Do you think it's the Konami code? That's immediately what I thought of, so probably not, but I know you love when there are ways to get to and play those wizard modes. This is clever. This is fine. This is when I start up Mortal Kombat and I want to do Infinite Lives or I want to do Easy Fatalities. I'm okay with this because you have to figure it out or you've got to search into your game guidebook that you get monthly.
    35:00
    These other ones are standalone modes with their own scoring. It's not playing the regular game, and it's like a mini game. Those are not okay, but it's okay to use a cheat code. No, I guess it's not. I'm having trouble seeing the difference. I said Escape from Nublar is fine for people who want to cheat. That's fine. I just would never do it. He was like, yeah, well, I've played this video game, and it gave me the option to choose my levels, and I could play the last level. I would never do that. You give me a GameShark, and I'm going to tear this up. No, I wouldn't access this Master Magician. Look, I've owned it. Hypocrisy this morning. I have owned Jurassic Park for weeks now. Do you think I've held the left flipper button in?
    35:49
    I don't know. Not once. No, never. Speaking of wonderful Final Wizard modes, Lord of the Rings. I almost want to cue the music. Howard Shore, I love you.
    36:05
    Because Lord of the Rings is one of Stern's greatest pinball machines of all time. One of the greatest pinball machines of all time. People are yelling from the rooftops, please vault this son of a bitch now. And we heard from a recent episode of Canada's Pinball Podcast that that was happening. Lord of the Rings is coming back, 100 limited edition models and this and that. Nope, nope, nope. So here's the rundown. Canada's Pinball Podcast was announcing that there was going to be this LE package. He made it sound like Stern may be releasing them, or it was just a limited release from some other pinball creator or mod maker.
    36:46
    It's very confusing, Dennis. I know you don't listen to Kaneda, but it confused a lot of people. I had people contact me. I'd like to get on this Lord of the Rings list. I'd like to get on it. But there is no list because, to my knowledge, Stern Pinball is not redoing Lord of the Rings with Lior Rajwan and the Art of Pinball. Now this Lior Rajwan, the artist that is creating, he has created new decals for Lord of the Rings. He is in the process of designing and creating a new play field with actual beautifully inked artwork that's going to be phenomenal. He said that, I've spoken with him, he said that he does plan on maybe making some mods and some sculpted 3D plastics or moldings for Lord of the Rings in the future. but he then came out and said publicly after Kaneda's false reports that no he's not selling a play field he's not doing any of that this is all just false false reporting and hopeful wishing here does that make you sad Dennis I mean I do think that Stern should vault Lord of the Rings I assume the reason they don't is probably a mix of factors including I mean, I'm unsure how many games they'd be able to sell. And the fact that this is not a Sam system, it's a White Star. So it's not as I'm assuming it's not as simple as vaulting Star Trek, vaulting Metallica, vaulting ACDC.
    38:11
    So which is why I think Tron has a higher likelihood than Lord of the Rings. That's what I always thought as well. Just because in terms of the system spec stuff, that would be easy for them. And I don't know that it's I don't know they're they're in any way equipped to go back to White Star. so yeah i mean i i really like lord of the rings so i would i'd love to see more of them out there but i again i i don't understand the context i saw uh jeff with this week in pinball had an article i did read that i love the look of the side cabinet art yeah like me a good saruman shot there so on the on that right side of that cabinet but i don't know how you take a custom game and then get confused and think that means there's a vault yeah i think there are some conflicting reports out there i was gonna i was gonna say the same thing when it came to this information i reached out because i've talked to leor in the past um reached out to him as well as a collector who we'll talk about here in a second i knew this was happening i wonder because i knew nothing about any of this any of it i i'm also not that tuned into the custom side really i've been dabbled a little bit more into it and i've talked to this collector he's a buddy of mine that he was getting this thing commissioned by this Lior Rajwan to be done. So I've seen pictures for weeks, the progress that this is making. So when I heard the podcast that Kaneda did, I thought, what in the hell? So I started talking with these gentlemen to get some information. But This Week in Pinball does what they do best, and they've got full pictures, explanations as to what's going on. So go over to thisweekinpinball.com to check out the details. This individual, this Lior Rajwan in The Art of Pinball, he's the one that's known for the Pirates of the Caribbean ship top replacement. This thing is nothing short of spectacular. With the look of Pirates of the Caribbean, the moldings and everything, how beautiful that is, the piece and the mod that he created for that pinball machine trumps even all of it in there already. It runs like a Raspberry Pi board. There's lighting effects, custom molding, custom painting. It is top-notch work. So anything that he does is going to be the top notch, the best of the best. So Jeff updated, the artwork for the decals is not for sale. And of course it's not. It's licensed property. They're using intellectual property from New Line Cinema and Lord of the Rings franchise films.
    40:36
    Now this Rajwan said that he created a couple sets of decals for him and a couple buddies that had damaged cabinets. So it's just a custom fun thing that he was doing. I'm with you, Dennis. it looks beautiful i would have not have went in that direction if i was redoing a lord of the rings uh but needless to say it looks at least five times better than the the standard that we've seen from stern pinball at minimum because of the printing technologies and the use of printing back then yeah i know it's a big criticism of the the kind of pixelated dot like you see the dots yes it's almost like newspaper yes um yeah with the with the ink ink print how they screened back then. Now I'm wondering, I wonder if I could get a custom Lord of the Rings art package for hoops. Oh, yes. Call it rings. Pass us. The three elven rings for the three saucers. I'm thinking, yeah, we could do that. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
    41:33
    What? Come on. I'd be like, I want new audio, though. It can't just keep saying, hurry up, hurry up. Tie your shoes. At least, yeah, at least. Watch out for the cats. He's just a golem going, precious, precious, the whole time or something. I'm going to use the same chips, so I don't have much space to bother. This Week in Pinball also pictured, and you can find this on the Art of Pinball's Twitter feed or Instagram feed, but a blurred out, work-in-progress, playfield artwork. So you can go check out that if you want to kind of see through. You can see through a lot of it. I've got the actual pic, and you know what it is. the composition stuff where these characters are at and the colors being used but no no company no individual involved has a license twip says to recreate or sell lord of the rings pinball machines or kits and then they said if if the company that is pursuing the license does get permission they would be selling the decals and possibly the play field but that now that goes against what i've talked with basically i've got a buddy he's the one that commissioned this thing out and he sent me a statement that he said I could read on the air if I'd like. And this guy, he's really, really sweet, really good guy, ambitious guy, and he was shocked by all this, but he said, he wrote to me, he said the following. I wanted to send you a quick update to the Canada podcast I listened to today called The King Returns. I want to confirm that this is my project for my machine. At this time, there is no intent to produce any more than one playfield, cabinet art package, and set of 3D plastics. This past Wednesday morning, I sent you, meaning me, one of our first proofs of what the new art package would look like on the machine. I also confirmed at that time that I commissioned Lior with the Art of Pinball to do this work for me. In my opinion, Lior is one of the best and most creative modification makers for pinball machines. Based on my relationship with Lior, it was a decision I felt very comfortable with, so this is confirmation that he is indeed creating a new playfield design for me and a new set of playfield plastics. I also, he talked about hiring a playfield reproduction company to work on the playfield. That company already has the playfield so that they can do the proper, quote, architectural file and PSD for the graphic overlays. Then it's going to be shipped and prepped for the art package printing. So why is he doing this? He wanted to kind of say he's got a lot of pinball machines he's been owning for the past 15 years but have only gotten serious about my hobby collection and passion in the past 18 months started with some mods lighting new side rails now this i found it very satisfying having my collection reflect my own personal taste which is what led me to many different modifications my most recent projects he's also doing a custom sting or star trek next generation package it's i like the regular artwork on that game, but the one that he's doing with these guys is phenomenal. But he talked about, oh, I got to say this, Dennis. This is, bear with me. He said, my favorite pinball shows to watch on YouTube is straight down the middle. I remember the episode where you and Greg discussed and raided Lord of the Rings pinball machine. I couldn't agree more with the way you guys broke down the game and how I wanted to take your vision of a redesigned art package to fruition. So you can take credit for the inspiration behind this project. Oh, my heart's melting. I did reach out to you during my big Lebowski rebuild to let you know about the project and this project. Oh, Dennis, my heart flutters with love. Love is in the air. See? We matter. All you hardcore collectors and competitive pinball players and pin-side naysayers, see? Straight down the middle matters, damn it. We inspire people, Dennis. Aren't you happy? That's what we're doing here at the Pinball Show. This is like the people thinking they're getting vaults and then having their dreams crushed is sort of all your fault. We inspire people to make what's awesome better. Inspire people. Yes. It's what we do. He also talked about reaching out to Gary Stern to see if there was any interest utilizing this art package for a vault run.
    45:46
    And I don't know if they're discussing or he's waiting to hear back or Gary just said, absolutely not. We'll do our own thing. So I don't know. He says the code's perfect. everything is perfect on this game except for the art and some of the uh plastics and stuff so he's making his own and that's it that's the story that's the truth i always feel like we have to counterpoint over here at the pinball show is that okay i guess you can do what you want why let people believe in lies lies i know i i understand where you're coming from on it but if they just keep coming, it seems like a never-ending task. I'm not a journalist. I'm not a journalist either. I chose not to be one, so... I'm a truth seeker, Dennis. You're not just a truth seeker. I only report the facts here. Yeah, you're just facts. You just like facts that matter as long as they involve straight down the middle. Look, when people throw mud, I get out the Windex. I'm just trying to clean you all up. You use the Windex, sir. You're just using ammonia-based cleaners on your Invisiglass. Yeah, that's fine. I'm just trying to clean the glass of your mind so that you guys can rest at night knowing the truth. That's it. Yeah, you don't want streaks on your mind glass.
    47:00
    I don't know. I hate that in physical. Windex may have a non-ammonia blend at this point. They do. They probably have an organic blend. Don't drink it. Don't put it in your body.
    47:11
    Poison control calls are up, Zach. All you need to do, take some Lysol, inject it. like a junkie. Put it in the main vein, baby. Get rid of that COVID. Have you seen the remix with that evangelist?
    47:32
    The one who blows the COVID away? Fire! Yeah. Oh, my God. That is the greatest. I love that. Then sang Moses and the children of Israel this song under the Lord.
    47:52
    COVID-19 I've blown the wind of God. I've listened to that a couple times. That guy's real scary.
    48:08
    Why? Why are you scared? Oh, no. It looks like he kind of got fangs He kind of scares me He scares me Sorry to all those listeners who follow him or something It's not a religious statement. It's just that man just scares me.
    48:26
    I think I had a dream about him the other night. Also, to wrap up the pinball news this week, Chicago Gaming Company's Medieval Madness Remake Royals are now shipping. They're trickling. Well, let's not joke ourselves. They're trickling. How are they getting them built? Well, we might have said that in a past podcast episode, but I think that they were waiting for like one part. Yeah, but aren't their factories closed? Or are you saying that they're in noncompliance with the Illinois order on a podcast?
    48:57
    No, I think what happened was – Are they in noncompliance? Is Chicago Gaming in noncompliance of an order to protect the health of the public? I truly think what has happened is they have taken all procedures that they do have people in there, but they probably have like one guy in there installing the last part in a lot of these things. That's it. Literally, the delay from January was like one part. What part? Tell us the part. I don't. I'm not at liberty to say the one part. You tell us the part. Swear to me. They might have included the drawbridge, but maybe it was just one part, and they're waiting for it. Where are the parts? I'll show you the difference between people who are good and people who are not as good. Who's slightly less good.
    49:51
    Here at the Pinball Show, we only report the facts. And what better way than to present to you this week's Pinball Show Presents... You know what it presents, Dennis? It presents conclusion.
    50:04
    Mother f***ing pinball market tree! Beep! They get the goal. Beep! They get the goal. Nope. That was a different beep. Didn't count. That wasn't a telegraph beep. That was just a sensor beep. That's fine. Then they get the f***ing llama. How about that? Beep!
    50:21
    I don't even remember the llama. We don't have one, but we do now. Training up this week as we alluded to it earlier in the episode. It's actually location pinball machines now up. Oh, for sale. Oh, have you seen them around the country? Oh, if you want to see a pinball machine for sale, look closely because it's probably coming from a location. They are unloading these things like Dutch Pinball wishes it would unload the Big Lebowskis.
    50:51
    Oh, yeah. Unfortunately, training up is just a ton of pinball machines that were on location that are now going into the homes of collectors. That's sad, Dennis. That implies that maybe, just maybe, a lot of these places either won't open back up, or if they do, the quantity of machines will be lessened. You got to pay the bills. There goes Lord of the Rings. The reports I'm seeing are complete. I mean, it's mixed. I've seen locations that have already confirmed they're closed. And then there's an extra, a lot of people who operate don't own the location. So, well, some locations appear to be gearing back up because of social distancing requirements and the new sanitation procedures the operators either can't operate the games or the volume would have to be so spaced out that i mean you're thinking about places that might have six games and they're going to have two and it's like is it worth it yeah is it worth it to have two on location maybe you see these some of these operators have multiple locations maybe you see them consolidate to drop a couple locations and i think it's going to be they're going to evaluate case by case in terms of just what the layouts will allow. I mean, we don't have our statewide Kansas guidance yet for post-COVID. I can tell you, though, that I sat in on a South Central part of the state meeting late last week, and they're coming up with their own regional plan. And one of the strategies that they're planning to do is the recommended next step is going to be businesses can be at 50% of their fire code, but have to maintain six foot separation at the same time. How do you do that? Well, and because of that requirement, most of them won't be able to get to the 50%. So there are a number of little places that are primarily carryout that – and these counts include the employee. Who's going to be enforcing this, Dennis? Well, in our state, it's – a lot of people have to self-report.
    52:45
    Citizens that are – no, well, I shouldn't say self-report. Self-reports are great. Citizens who are upset file complaints, usually through the health department. health department has to ask law enforcement to enforce the order that shit's gonna happen and and in our state health departments when it comes to pandemic do have the authority to tell law enforcement to enforce the order uh most of the time it's a misdemeanor with a fine associated with it yeah it's it's a cluster it is a cluster and uh some people think that we are prematurely opening up the floodgates and uh we'll see what we'll see what happens but you will see increased infection. It's well, yeah, it's just, it will happen. It's a question of the surge capacity and the strategy is supposed to be when we see new cases crop up, you encircle, you sort of encircle them, isolate them and start doing the treatment and deal with anyone they came into close contact with. Problem that we have is we still don't have enough tests to actually execute that. But I'm hoping next week we do, because I am going to assume we're going to relax our orders next week statewide. locally they'll make their own decisions because parts of our state are seem to be on the other side of the peak now and parts of our state are still seeing increases it just depends ladies and gentlemen the only individual can take the world's favorite pinball podcast segment make it depressing dennis creasel you brought up how location machines for sale was trending up now i'm all depressed trending up this week is lord of the rings as well because the art pack why they're making new ones aren't they yeah that's why it's trending up people are going to be trying to grab grab grab bye bye bye those lord of the rings just in hopes that maybe somebody will make those decals to the to the market maybe somebody will make one of those play fields they're hoping they're wishing they're praying so they're gobbling up all those ball rocks gobbling them up would you gobble the ball rock i like lord of the rings i've never owned it though yeah i like it as well also turning up this week oh if if the love doesn't get any bigger we get a lot of big love coming my way and i can't get enough of it we heard it from that collector that said that i single-handedly was his inspiration behind this massive project that's gonna change the change the landscape of the greatest machine ever made so unhelpful he has no idea the damage he's done personally it gets worse tennis or better in my case because if you haven't listened to the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast, and they had on Roger Sharp. And, in fact, ladies and gentlemen, he is trending up this week. Trending up is Roger Sharp. Oh, why, you ask, Dennis? I don't, because he wasn't even in the show notes in your market trend lineup. No, of course he wasn't. I wanted to sneak this one on you. Roger Sharp, ladies and gentlemen, you know how emphatic, how creative I have been when it comes to pitching competitive pinball and getting it televised, and I'm here to tell you one thing and one thing only. The father of pinball, Moses himself, Roger Sharp, suggested the same f***ing thing that I pitched last year publicly about standardized pinball machines for application in competitive pinball and televised airing. I rest my case. I take a bow. I take this mic, if it wasn't attached to a tripod, and I drop it in front of all of you haters. Yeah, that's you, Dr. John. Yeah, that's you, Steve Bowden. All you haters. That's you, Jeff Teolis. I heard you in the background there. I think it was Josh Sharp. Pooh-poohing. Old non-competitive pinball player Zach's idea of a standardization. Yeah, not only did Roger Sharp talk about a group in Canada approaching him about this years back, but offered some good ideas that these individuals were suggesting, as well as a way to make things more objective. Now, he did say that, you know, every machine is going to differ, but he thought it was, you know, I'm going to interpret his word. He kind of thought it would be a... Well, yeah, we're going to interpret... I could tell by your phrasing about standardization, which is not a word you ever used in your pitches. I thought it was, oh, that's what I pitched, Dennis. That is what I pitched, and you know it. Ten generic machines, all by Stern, and that they were all going to be, and then they, of course, you would have the standardized setup as a byproduct, but your main goal seemed to be driven by just wanting to be able to not have issues with Twitch censoring the music and stuff. No, it was a multi-factor approach in what I am starting to call the mini competitive series pinball machines. He made that pitch as well, the father of pinball and Roger Sharp, and he even said it would be more digestible to the general public standardizing some of these games. Oh, man, if I didn't jump out of my truck while it was moving hearing this, I'm speechless, Dennis. I'm so speechless. I mustache you, Roger. Can you be any sexier? You see the mustache. I mustache you.
    58:06
    Roger Sharp's my hero. Maybe Roger Sharp and I should have a sit-down, a meeting. You know, the great minds of pinball, sitting down, creating the next frontier for everybody else that just leaves it in the dust, waiting for somebody to step up. Maybe Roger Sharp and I are those people. Hashtag just saying. I love that we have video Skype going this recording and I get to see Dennis throughout this entire segment unfortunately trending down this week is injecting bleach into no sorry wrong podcast trending down this week is false podcast reporting and being sold as fact uh oh wait a minute Zach do we really want to go here yeah do we all I ever wanted was peace can we not have peace why are you the aliens from independence day i'm merely the truth seeker that's all i am i only report the facts here numbers don't lie and there's been some people telling fibs and i can't let that sit with our listeners i love them too much you guys are like family on a recent canadus pinball podcast titled i don't even know what it was titled at this point but he had a two-part series that talked about all of the atrocities of Jersey Jack Pinball. The negligent, ooh, negligence. Basically, he shit all over Jersey Jack Pinball, saying that Pat Lawler owns the company now. They got rid of Butch Peel because they're evil people. Jack Guarneri has lost control of this company now that investors and owners are in there. He went on and on and on. Now, for entertainment purposes, that's fine. Sure. People listen. But when it's sold as fact, I'm here to counterbalance it out with actual truth.
    59:59
    Chris Coolers from Canada's Pinball Podcast made a statement that Pat Lawler is in control. He said, quote, this entire company is Pat Lawler Design Company now, end quote. Wrong. Mr. Kaneda also suggested. Execute order. Toy story. Well, close. He also suggested that people know him in the industry as Lord Lawler. That's what they refer to him as. Wrong. Fact-checking suggests they really don't. That's the first time I've heard of that, and I've not heard of any of the inside people I know as friends that have referred to him as that. Continuing our fact-checking, Chris Cooler said, quote, Ask David Thiel if he'd ever want to do a game again with Pat Lawler, end quote.
    60:43
    Wrong. Yep, yep. Yeah, that unfortunately was a false accusation as well, because David Thiel actually contacted Chris Goulish from Canada's Pinball Podcast and said, hey, can you retract that because that's not true at all. I would absolutely work with Pat Lawler. This is why David posted. Okay, I saw a post from him on Facebook that said he would work with Pat Lawler. I was like, this is out of the blue. What does it have to do with anything? Because I know David's over with Deep Root, so I didn't know the context. The mystery the clouds have lifted. Canada got upset last time that I did some fact-checking, So I assume that he's going to get, we have fun back and forth, and I assume he's going to get upset about this. Again, Chris, I know you're listening. Look, I'm just trying to set the people straight and let them know truth from falsities. That's all. Chris also said that there was no one left from the original employees. They're all gone. He said, quote, all the hardworking people who made it Jersey Jack Pinball have been shown the door. End quote. Wrong. Leave Britney alone. No. yep that's that's wrong as well plenty of the people who started out there are still there still have the same amount of passion if not more as they've learned through the working with people like butch peel jack winery pat lawler eric menier was there from wizard of oz keith johnson has been there from day one he's still there joe katz is still there ted estes is still there there's a lot of people still there that's that's not true he also made it sound like technician frank i'm just gonna call him technician frank that i'm sorry are you we're gonna go through the i know you love this segment you like to make it longer are we going to go through the entire line here i mean checking facts here he made it sound like frank was let go with this whole transition to chicago wrong yeah news alert frank was let go or quit i don't even know what happened but frank's been gone for months it's not the case as well chris also implied the passion is the passion has left the building when jack lost control of the company he said the investors are now yelling at jack rennery they're yelling at him dennis and he's just an excited guy that's it wrong no that's that's false as well i can tell you knowing these investors and knowing these Majority owners, they're very pumped up about where Jersey Jack Pinball is headed in the future, and they have every intention of utilizing every resource they need to make this company grow and compete year after year. It might be boring, but that's just the facts. Canadian Pinball Podcast also implied that the majority owners and investors, quote, just don't care as much as you think they do about these games. He goes on to say, a company that's run by money and ego.
    63:35
    He also said JJP employs, quote, sleazy sales tactics, end quote. Wrong. Canada's really going after this company right now. You know news is slow whenever you have these wild, outlandish episodes full of false statements that rile people up and force people to show hatred and disgust towards other human beings. all being of which a part of a group that we all want to support and see grow and evolve and at the end of all this i love this political pitch he says this all all this at this point kind of slander that he has presented is evidence of truth because no one from jjp will publicly come on his show to offer counterpoints wrong oh no no no no oh yeah that's not how that works that's how it works i guess that is not how it were i'm sorry socratic questioning there i mean no you do not holy shit yeah that's why it's the truth since nobody will speak up you do not get to just try and well i guess you can try to just bait people to come and talk to you by making accusations, wild accusations, and then saying that they are in some way obligated to respond. That is not how to, when people make accusations that, in fact, I had Jeff with This Week in Pinball a few weeks ago reach out to me to say that a certain someone had made accusations and I'm like, that doesn't affect me. It's not my obligation to, my record speaks for itself. That's right. It's not my obligation to go out and correct every mistruth because it's not possible to know about every mistruth that's said about you. It's just not possible. And if it's not valid, it's not valid. I had some nasty things said about me over the last couple of months publicly. You could go down a very dark spiral. Well, you're the psychologist. You could go down a very dark spiral if you try and deal with that. Exactly. So if it's not true, you just chalk it off as like, what am I going to do? You try to at least.
    65:40
    Some things get to people more than others. I can confirm that. Yes, we can. But it's like, yeah. And that's something about – and maybe it happens in all the hobbies. But just – and I don't want to go on a rant. I didn't hear all of this except for what you've reported. I like your rants. Well, I'm just – there are things that I think sometimes in this hobby that happen that people think, oh, it's just for entertainment and it's just for fun. And they just run people through. Yep. and I don't ever have a problem saying, I think that game's a turd, or I don't like this, I don't like that, and I'll always tell you the truth. Yeah. But I don't go about and then say, and because of that, this person is a bad person. Mm-hmm. And that happens in this hobby a lot. Yes, it does. And I don't think it's healthy. It's definitely unprofessional. Yeah. I would like people, and I'm just speaking, you know, broadly, I would like people to maybe try to do better. I'm not going to even ask you to be more considerate. Just do better. I like that. I like that. And there's a difference between giving your opinion on the design of a game or the animation of a game versus talking about employment issues or talking about employment matters.
    66:53
    There's a difference. There just is a difference. I mean, even if you wanted to go and speak about employment decisions, it would be seen – again, it would be seen as unprofessional. Legally, you can't. Yeah. They can't come out and talk about that. And aside from some open – like governments may be able to tell you a little bit about some aspects of things like how much they pay their employees and such. But terminations and things even are protected as non-open record for a reason. Absolutely. Because these are people's lives. They're private lives. So yeah. It's not your place to know. It's not my place to know either. Yeah, and the reason that Jersey Jack's probably not coming out publicly to say anything is because it's none of our fucking business. How about that? No, it is not. It is not. To end off this trending down a false podcast reporting and sold as fact, to be fair, Kaneda also reported in a couple episodes ago that Barry from Dutch Pinball, after designing one pinball machine, that he was the best designer of all time. So consider the source here. I'm going to end it on this note. Quote, unquote, information. Quote, unquote, facts that you have heard on Canada's Pinball Podcast in the most recent JJP episodes. Chris Koulouris said that these facts and information, wait for it, folks, has been derived from, quote, human behavior. I can't make this shit up. And, quote, common sense. ladies and gentlemen if you are getting your facts and information from a source that is deriving their information from human behavior and common sense maybe you need to find a different source because ladies and gentlemen I don't know about you but when it comes to common sense and human behavior not sure Chris Kaluers would be the first person I'd follow when it comes to that. Listeners just all I'm asking And this stuff is entertainment. I'm not telling you not to listen. Hell, I listen because it is entertaining at times. It makes me laugh. It makes me cringe. It is good entertainment. But don't forget that it is nothing more than entertainment. Don't confuse entertainment with information.
    69:09
    Dennis, I can't even do a deal of the week at this point. I feel dirty. So in a way, we've all won, really. now hopefully i inspired some of you like i inspired roger sharp and like i inspired this my collector i'd hope you've forgotten about that with this weird rant this fact-checking rant you went on the sad thing is roger sharp doesn't know who i am nor has he listened to any of my stuff i think he does and i don't think he likes you that was a pitbull show for says pitbull market trends no deals of the week this week oh you know what ladies and gentlemen i'll give you a deal of week no don't squeeze i'll create my own the deal of the week this week is a stranger things with four plays it's brand new we unboxed it for louisville show and the ramp itself the motor uh i suspected i didn't like it as play three but it took the fourth one for sure the board for the motor uh was faulty so brian eddie told me that just fold this one up we'll have to get a replacement board got the replacement board out there but it's unboxed and technically it's got three test plays on it so it's used fifty one hundred dollars boom there's your deal of the week bye bye bye all right let's end episode 11 with a fun little yeah let's end it but no we gotta do a little fun segment now we've done this before i don't think we've ever done this on the pinball show so we're gonna resurrect it man get out your ouija board we're gonna resurrect a little segment we like to call the pinball shows flippers and foils listeners that aren't familiar with this game this is a game where i read the contestant the name of a character that appears on a pinball machine the contestant then has to name another character on the pinball machine and for extra points name the game the manufacturer and the date if you're super special. The way this goes, I'm going to say something like, Dennis, you're the blank to my... And then I'm going to say Indiana Jones. And then he'd come back and say, short round. Boom. And then he would say, Indiana Jones a pinball adventure. Boom. And then he would say, Williams. Boom. And then for extra points, he would say, 1995... 4? I don't even know. I thought 4, but I'm not sure. So let's play a little flippers and foils, shall we, Dennis? Okay. Oh, Dennis, to me, you've always been the blank to my mystique.
    71:39
    Hmm. The blank to my mystique. Professor X. Okay. Not the direction I was going, but yeah, that's correct. Okay. Care to name the... Now, be careful here, because what I know about this, after researching in between edited out segments, that Mystique is actually on what title? The X-Men. Yeah, you said Professor X, so you're going to X-Men because I was thinking Deadpool. Right, which I can see why. That would have been more obvious But actually the one on location we had was the Magneto LE edition Damn it So I believe she in the side art there on the cab body Ladies and gentlemen, I thought I messed up initially. So I was like, damn it, is Mystique on the X-Men? And I looked and looked, and she is, but she only appears, to my knowledge, on the Magneto version. I can't stump Dennis. All right. Who made the X-Men pinball machine? That was Stern Pinball. Any guesses to when they made that? Oh, gosh.
    72:52
    Is that 2013? It was close, 2012. I didn't realize it was that old. Yeah, it's been. I mean, that was based off of the comic theme, actually. That's probably the weirdness of it. Yeah, no. I'll tell you what, man. Kind of an underrated game. Yeah, I was going to say. I wouldn't mind picking up a Magneto again. I owned it earlier in my hobby. My only problem with those LEs is that moving Iceman ramp. It's kind of annoying. I know. I don't mind it as much because I like all the other upgrades you get. So it surpasses it for me. Yeah, we get that one on location from time to time. I believe it is the Magneto. One of the prettiest spin motions ever made. The code is, if you upgrade the sound, maybe the sound package, you get color DMD in it. maybe i don't i just don't remember the modes being that fun but there's a lot there yeah whenever i played i usually play sentinel mode um and then i'm just trying to get like the hellfire club or something so i can go into a multi-ball mode i just hate the wolverine mode oh but you love the storm call outs it's better than i don't know if most people would agree with you about that Stunned I'm waiting for her to say jackpot Alright On to the next item He nailed the first one Except I didn't get the date right Well but that's worth two points I mean here nor there I can't get a perfect now Well you'll always be perfect Ruined Alright Dennis you're the blank to my Augustus Gloop Oh Oh.
    74:41
    Augustus Galoop. Yes. I know which game. I'm just trying to remember the names of the other characters. I know.
    74:51
    Mike TV. Mike TV works. What game is this from? Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory. That is correct. You could have got stung up and went Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, but it is, in fact, Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, manufactured by... Jersey Jack Pimple. And the year it was manufactured? Or the year it was released, rather. Yeah, 2019. That is correct. That's a perfect score. Augustus Gloop. Yeah. Now, I wanted to say Charlie, but I couldn't remember if his last name was Puckett or Buckett or what. Charlie Buckett. Mm-hmm. Yep, yep, yep. I was trying to stump you up. I was like, he's too crafty to go Willy Wonka. He's wanting to flex his knowledge muscles here. I was trying to flex on you.
    75:34
    You could have went Veruca Salt. And the problem was I couldn't remember her first name. Oh, I see. I want it now, Zachy. I want it now. I want my Willy Wonka pinball machine now. I was the first kid that messed up by drinking the chocolate water. Looked like poo.
    75:53
    I couldn't resist. Third item. Dennis, you're the blank to my cheese head. Cheese head. Bedhead. Say that again Bed head Yeah that's me typing Unfortunately Dennis I think that is incorrect And by thinking it's incorrect That's because we searched it together And we found it incorrect Yes But uh I'm wrong Yeah you got them mixed up there Your heads right Yeah I was thinking I was visually thinking of sleepy head though bad does sound like bad head but there was there is a bad head yeah i was thinking a sleepy head nobody likes bad head my favorite is good head right and i made up and just gave them bed head that joke still works in 2020 now what game was that though i was thinking of scared stiff that's correct that's correct uh manufacturer uh that's a bally i think from wms yeah you know how i like to differentiate the bally williams even if they are i know you do so bally and any guesses to the date oh gosh uh 95 close 96 oh okay i thought if anything i was too late in the years okay 96 nicely done pumpkin head all right on to the fourth item there are five there are five items in this game but the fourth item is you my friend are the blank to my peeping tom Peeping Tom The reference is even more creepy nowadays Considering the designer But Peeping Tom I guess I'll go with the most obvious one And say The Creature That's actually correct Nicely done What game was that from? Creature from the Black Lagoon And if you guys have noticed listeners I have been taking some of them some of these visual characters from the DMD. A little cheating here, but that's okay. I realized that when you went with Cheesehead.
    78:05
    Sorry about that. So Creature from the Black Lagoon, the manufacturer was... I know it's a WMS game, but I'm trying... I'm going to say Bally again. That is correct. The Bally Williams are the ones that I'm really good at remembering for some reason, because some of... Backbox? no not so much the back box on the WPC stuff but like some titles just feel more like a Bally and some feel more structured and gritty like a William I don't I heard they flipped a coin to decide is that right I I mean I don't know they literally did I heard someone say yeah it was essentially a coin flip to determine which uh which branding a game would have once they owned a ballot yeah because if you go back and look at the title of what were Bally and what were Williams they do seem to fit in two separate yeah categories I mean for a while right after the early acquisition one of the things I noticed this is back when I was writing my street level article was that they tended to do lower production runs on the Bally's but obviously that wasn't the case with Adam's family yeah that's true yeah because like if you think about Attack from Mars is a Bally but Medieval Madness that's a Williams you think about um Twilight Zone is a Bally Indiana Jones Williams Strong Williams You've got the Addams Family Kooky Fun Bally You've got Scared Stiff Bally I don't know It's just always That's why I remember them Star Trek The Next Generation Williams Terminator 2 Williams Tales of Arabian Nights Williams Okay You know I don't know Simmer down Williams Circus Voltaire Bally Yeah Okay Sorry that makes no sense on to the last item on flippers and I guess you didn't ask but I'll go ahead and say I think 92 was the year that is correct I thought it was real early in the DMD there was really a lot of stuff going on for a 92 game yeah oh yes actually that game really grew on me quite a bit I really do like that game not listener not for your one or two pin lineup I assure you No, no, no. I've not seriously considered trying to get one. I think it goes for too much for what it is. They do. But I like to play it if I see it. Fun shooter. Looks beautiful. Yep. All right. Last item at Flippers and Foils.
    80:31
    You are the blank to my Abraham Van Helsing. Or Abraham Van Helsing. Yes. We'll go with Dracula. Dracula is correct. It always bugs me how he can say Dracula. Culla. The proper Romanian pronunciation. Draculio.
    80:58
    That's who does your hair. No, that is Chino. Oh, Chino. Don't fuck with Chino, my friend. Dracula. He's on the glass trying to bite women's necks a lot. And on the DMD. We've been spending most of our lives living in bloody paradise. Oh, my God. Sorry. Where's Michelle Pfeiffer? We've got the title of the game would be? Brom Stoker's Dracula. Are you going to go Stroker or Stoker? Stoker. There we go. We'll stoke that fire, baby, because you're correct. Who was the manufacturer of Brom Stoker's Dracula? Brom Stoker's. Another WMS game. oh does it convey whimsy or does it convey serious yeah i think it's a william that's correct my theory is intact well it's like it's fantastical but blood yes that's right i guess if i understand the zach equation right you know what that might be something to johnny mnemonic williams williams that's right okay i'm actually gonna go through the list of games i think when i get some time and see if it's that this might actually be the first theory of yours that's actually valid cactus canyon valley sorry i keep doing this and and for the listener oh sorry one more the getaway high speed tube williams i but uh no there's i've i've uh omitted some of the ones that made no sense oh yeah yeah of course all right so it is brom stoker's dracula there's a williams uh guess as to when they first revealed and released or first released this game uh 94? Close, 93. You're always just a year off if off at all. Yeah, I'm not. That's hard. Years can be tricky. That's when you went through puberty, wasn't it? 93?
    82:52
    Around then, maybe. About 19, 20 years old. I was not quite that old. I was nine. That would be more like 98 or so. I was nine.
    83:03
    All right, ladies and gentlemen, that was the Pinball Show's Flippers and Foils. email us in if you got all the questions right because i want you to battle the creasel if you got 100 on that because that would be fun would you be up for a flippers and foils battle i don't know how that would work but i guess hey well there's a will there's a way and i will find it remember i'm kind of the guy that inspired roger sharp oh yes that's right poor roger sharp he's gonna retract all of that just because he doesn't want to have to hear me and zach and Josh rolling their eyes right now. Sorry, fellas.
    83:40
    All right, Dennis, our time here is up for episode 11. I'm just going to sit at home alone and cry over you. Until next week when we air episode 12. But until then, these people can check out a lot of cool stuff on the Pinball Network. Remember to follow us on Facebook. You can go to the pinballnetwork.net. As well as, what else have we got? Oh, follow us on Twitch, too. We've got a lot of affiliates on the TPN channel there. Follow us on YouTube. Follow us a little bit here, there, and everywhere. Hell, we've got a pin-side thread, too. You can join in. Last week on the Pinball Network, we had some really good podcasts. We had the Final Round Pinball Podcast. I believe they're in episode six. But they had Doug Polka from Papa talking about the recent events and who better to hear from about what's going to happen with ReplayFX's Pinberg than to hear it from Doug Polka. A favorite of many, the Silver Ball Chronicles came out with Episode 3, where they covered Dennis Gottlieb. What was that, System 3s? Yeah, it was System 3. They touched a little bit on a few ADBs as well, but the focus of the episode was System 3.
    84:52
    That was interesting. I have heard that episode. That was very interesting. Yeah, yeah. I saw they had some, you know, I saw some fans coming out of the woodwork saying things like, oh, I wish you guys had talked more about things like Big Hurt. Yeah. It's like, oh, the Big Hurt fans out there. I saw the guy in the back with the sign that was like, John Norris is a god. Hey, John Norris has been a valued resource on knowing about what happened through that huge stretch of Premiere. because I think he came in right around when Premiere itself started and got a hold of the Gottlieb brand. Oh, and the street levels.
    85:28
    And so, yeah, I mean, he was involved on street levels. I think he did half of them because he took over one of the Trudeau designs. And then I think he had two of his own, and then Tanzer had the rest. I'm just really proud of the network and the podcasters because there's some different avenues that haven't really been touched on much in pinball podcasting or not to the extent that some of these headliners are doing it in competitive pinball final round you got the chronicles uh that i learned so much from the history of pinball you got silver ball stories with the illustrations and new storytelling if you could add a topic to the network's podcast like an area that you don't think we cover very well what would you add that's a really good question um i mean i i do wish we had more of those uh I think we unofficially call them one-and-dones. Yeah, off the record would be great. Off the record, yeah. I don't know why people are so scared to just record an episode. It's a blast. Just stick a mic in front of your face and your buddy's face and record an episode. It would be a lot of fun. We are developing something that the correspondents, you may hear them in their own podcast pilot episode coming very soon. We've got to see if they're ready to roll that out. um but yeah i would that would be good repair discussion may not translate well into podcast i've wondered if someone could that's the thing i've wondered you could really because i've heard other podcasts cover repair i think it's very difficult like you can tell that they know what they're talking about but it can be very difficult to visualize it yeah but maybe there's a way to make it entertaining that'd be an interesting job well we got duncan with arcade crusade uh he's a TPM provider for the YouTube show. He did that full flipper rebuild. Very thorough, very well done. I've seen some very positive comments. Yeah, that was really well done. He said, I think his next video for TPN may be, uh, how to install in the ROM, which a lot of people want to know, uh, because I've never done it myself. I had somebody do it for me, but that would be a really cool video. So be on the lookout for that. I think I would want maybe, uh, maybe an interview show. Jason Fowler was going to do an interview show. Crystal, I'm wondering if she's kind of going that way with the plum because she's had a few interviews lately. And that one's cool because, again, it's another offering that is so unique. She's talking to the showrunners and the people that participate in the shows, the dealers and stuff. Yeah, you get that. But, yeah, maybe some more interviews from people would be kind of cool. I don't know. I'm so proud of where we've come in, what, three months. So it's awesome. Dennis, can you tell people when they're not looking for you at TPN or the pinball show, where can they find you? Well, every other week I do the Eclectic Gamers Podcast with my co-host Tony. You can always reach out to me through that.
    88:17
    Oh, God. You made it sound like some sort of fiddle, Devil Came Down to Georgia sort of stuff there. But eclecticgamerspodcast.gmail.com. You can always email them there. I do see the pinballnetworkatgmail.com emails as well when I choose to look at them. They're mostly for Zach, though, so I typically ignore them if they're not from puppets. Oh, I know. I want to hear the puppets. That's what I'm missing. I'm missing my puppet pals, Pinball Puppet Pals. Oh, man. If you're looking for me, you can catch me here at thepinballnetworkatgmail.com, or I've been streaming on Mondays for Monday Night Pinball. It's still a work in progress, still not where I want to be with it, but we're going to try to do some creative things over there. We're still trying to talk Dennis Creasel into streaming for the Flippin' Out team as well. He's still a bit apprehensive. Email the pinball network at gmail.com if you'd like to see Dennis Creasel streaming the most beautiful and brand new pinball machines from Flippin' Out Pinball. And if you'd like one yourself, you can give me a call at 812-457-9711 or email me at Zach, Z-A-C-H, at Flipp, the letter N, outpinball.com or check out the website at flippinoutpinball.com. Now, I will say from a distribution standpoint, stocks are getting lower and lower. Some of these titles are really difficult to find. Check in with us to see if we have it in stock, and if not, I'll try to help point you in the right direction for a distributor that may have those. So call me. I'll help you out in any way or shape or form that I possibly can. Unless you're like, Dennis, I'm still getting people that call like, hey, I just bought this machine. Can you help me fix it? And I'm like, when did you buy it? About a month ago. I love your shows. Love your YouTube. Oh, thanks, man. Oh, they buy them from someone else and they call you for tech help? And I'm like, where did you buy it? And they're like, I bought it from Trent. I'm like, they fucking call Trent.
    90:11
    No, I don't. I'm like, here, I've tried this. That is funny, though. Funny is a good way to – They feel they have this relationship with you, but they don't want to taint it with money.
    90:22
    That's what it is. No. So in a way, it's quite respectable. Taint it with money. My kids are hungry. Never alone, friends. I'm going to insert music here. Right now, eating all the Cheetos. No. I have something in front. Like, you guys have a bunch of Cheetos and ketchup. That's right. And they're just squirting them on the ball as they go around, fighting over who gets to jump into the above ground. Oh, can we please on Pinside – I know you all mean well. I do. But can we please quit having the TPN thread being – discussing quotes on swimming pools?
    90:56
    It's like I saw all these posts. I was like, what controversial thing got said on final round? and I click and it's just like people giving you quotes on and I'm like no this is not we don't know pool market trends turning out this week is the price of these expensive in-ground pools have you quoted your contract of concrete work is it stamped uh is it rubble what is it what up a liner how often will you have to replace it yeah you're gonna roll it out yourself and you have an automatic one the choice is yours but there's only one correct answer no yeah it has it has i love that uh it's very very natural and open that thread is i like that also you can check us out on straight down the middle of pinball show sdt and pinball gmail.com if you want to email us we have a new quarantined uh episode that's coming out that we did skype and we actually so here's the episode i think it's 108 um it is using the metrics and system created by dennis creasel from the eclectic gamers podcast we go back through the vault of reviews that we have done and we recalculated every single previous reviewed game oh yeah that's right you still have the old score into the new weighted system so now at the end of that episode when you see that list they are all equally weighted we also took the time to do some little nips and tucks on uh some of the upgrades or on some of the reviews and changes and i'll let you know that there we go great inflation has happened yeah we just we nip and tuck a little bit here to you know this one i'm not as hot on anymore this one has grown into something i love you got to keep them updated and we're going to have that formulated and up on a website for you to submit your own using your own weighted scores but to have a database of different reviews so that is coming very soon be on the lookout for that all right everybody for dennis creasel i'm zach many Yeah, everyone have a good liver, have a great kidney, have a nice night. And if not, we will have to wait and see. Always practice safe pinball and cranky up. So long, everybody. COVID-19. FedEx lady, she always says on my voicemail when I got games there, come get you some. I go in there, I always mess with her. I'm like, what up? Get you some. and she's like I bet you would like to get you some I'm like easy there tiger and then you squeeze her mom's ass I got the black lung pop I do put ketchup on my meatloaf well that's standard oh why not mustard well mustard sometimes I think might get mixed into the meat blend but they don't put it on top I don't think maybe someone else Keep your filthy mustard out of my meatloaf, thank you. Why do you hate flavor? No, mustard, I don't like it. I don't like sweet pickles either. Well, no, sweet pickles are gross, but they don't taste anything like mustard. No, but they still got that. I like dill pickles, but only if they're the midgets. I don't like a big pickle. I don't want to stick a big pickle in my mouth, and I don't like a sliced pickle. They creep me out because they're like crinkle cut. I don't like those. Those are weird. it has to be like a midget it's got to be a little one I can stick in my mouth it's very particular you only want the baby carrot pickles that's right I think big carrots freak me out too just give me the little snackable ones I once years ago I brought a bag of just regular carrots to work and someone laughed at me watching me eat the carrot what it was like a big one yeah it was greenery hanging off of it too like well yeah but i had the butt part wrapped up in a paper towel you couldn't see the green part because i don't like because i was washing before yeah of course and i don't like the water running down my hands and they just i there she was just laughing i said what is so funny she goes you just look like like a ridiculous bugs bunny yeah i was like so i just closed my office door i want to see you on the centerfold just snapping that carrot with That juice running down your chest.
    95:13
    In your Jurassic Park pose. That's right. With the carrot. That's right. With the carrot juice gushing all over. Well, yeah, you got to, you know, trace it around your lips first. Jeez.
    95:26
    You got a purdy mouth there, style. I call for a super... Oh, sorry, I got a motorcycle going by. No, you're fine.
    95:36
    Sound like a hog. Harley. oh yeah it's like someone doesn't have a muffler where's your social distancing dick you don't do it you don't do it you don't do it you get get get get get out of here Now!
    96:05
    Burn! You don't do it! You get out of here! Burn this thing! COVID-19! I'll blow!
    96:20
    The wind of God! You are destroyed forever, and you will never be back.