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BackRoom: What a Mother Bucker

BlahCade Pinball Podcast·podcast_episode·21m 38s·held·Jan 27, 2016
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Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.027

TL;DR

Hosts rant about entitled pinball app users making unreasonable demands and complaints.

Summary

BlahCade's BackRoom episode critiques community complaints about Farsight's pinball app updates and Dark River Kickstarter. Hosts dismiss entitled user feedback about EM table releases, new UI design, and Kickstarter rewards, arguing that constructive criticism is rare and that users often fail to understand technical constraints or provide meaningful alternatives.

Key Claims

  • The new Farsight UI is necessary because the old UI is at maximum capacity and cannot accommodate additional features

    high confidence · Host discussing UI redesign: 'The functionality is why they need the new UI... it is bursting... you can't put any more into that UI'

  • Stern pinball machines will no longer be released through the Farsight app due to Stern developing its own app

    high confidence · Host: 'Sam Stern release from now on isn't going to be through the Farsight app... Stern may as well be off the table for TPA as part of their product release'

  • The Dark River Kickstarter faces perception issues due to lack of frequent updates, echoing problems from previous campaigns

    high confidence · Host explaining snowball effect: 'it's a rolling snowball getting larger and larger and you have a shorter amount of time to eliminate that so it's already started... three days into the Kickstarter'

  • The The Addams Family Gold cannot be used as a Kickstarter reward due to licensing issues

    medium confidence · Host: 'They cannot put The The Addams Family Gold as a reward. I think there's licensing issues.'

  • Farsight should monitor its Kickstarter every two hours rather than every few days to engage with backers

    medium confidence · Host: 'You need to be checking in on it every two hours, if not more... seeing what people are saying so that you can interact with them then and there'

  • El Dorado plays significantly better than City of Gold with improved visuals and no annoying background sound

    medium confidence · Host: 'I can tell you by playing the beta, it plays differently. It looks way better. You don't have the annoying background sound. I will be playing Eldorado way more'

  • The EM table pack is currently in beta on Google with build issues preventing carousel access

    high confidence · Host: 'The EM pack is in beta at the moment on Google... there have been some build issues with it. So we can't test it at the moment... it crashes the game'

Notable Quotes

  • “You're essentially getting the table for free. We've already discussed this. If you're going to buy six tables, the other four wind up being free.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~2:30 — Core argument about value perception in subscription model

  • “Because your $4.99 is going to make or break the table.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~4:00 — Dismissal of perceived powerless complaint tactics

  • “Is your ego bigger than your pinball flipper fingers? Or what is going on here?”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~6:30 — Challenge to player priorities and community values

  • “It's basically you're living in a small apartment, and you're now having to keep your clothes in the kitchen drawers because you've already run out of space elsewhere.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~11:00 — Metaphor for technical constraints driving design decisions

  • “The minute you say, I'm not going to be a customer, that means they don't have to please you anymore. Okay, good. No, that's one less person we have to worry about.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~7:00 — Reframe of customer power dynamics in small niche market

  • “You've got to sell the sizzle, not the sausage.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~44:00 — Core marketing principle about targeted audience appeal

  • “You need to be nurturing these people. You need to be making them feel cool about their expenditure so that they'd be willing to maybe even pitch in more.”

    [name withheld pending review] @ ~51:00 — Strategy for maintaining and growing campaign momentum

  • “If there's something wrong that you are finding it hard to use, well, don't just say, I don't like it, because that's going to get ignored. Say, I don't like it because this and this and this.”

    [name withheld pending review] — Framework for distinguishing useless complaints from actionable feedback

Entities

Farsight StudioscompanyThe Pinball Arcade (TPA)productDoctor WhogameFireballgameEl DoradogameCity of GoldgameStern PinballcompanyScott DenisepersonNorman (Norman Duke)person

Signals

  • ?

    product_concern: EM table pack beta on Google experiencing build issues preventing carousel access and crashing game; developer working excessive hours

    high · Host: 'there have been some build issues with it... we can't access the table carousel. It crashes the game'

  • ?

    community_signal: Hosts express frustration with recurring entitled community complaints about rewards, features, and exclusivity that lack constructive substance

    high · Multiple rants about 'silly complaints,' 'whinging people,' and calls for constructive feedback instead of threats

  • ?

    content_signal: Hosts criticize Farsight's Kickstarter community engagement, noting delayed moderation of trolls and infrequent backer communication

    high · Host: 'You need to be checking in on it every two hours, if not more... trolls took about two days to ban... damage that it does is massive'

  • ?

    licensing_signal: Farsight unable to license TAF Gold as Kickstarter reward due to licensing restrictions; Stern games no longer coming to TPA due to Stern's own app development

    high · Host: 'They cannot put TAF gold as a reward. I think there's licensing issues' and 'Any Stern release from now on isn't going to be through the Farsight app'

  • ?

    product_strategy: Farsight redesigning UI due to technical capacity limits of old UI; new design enables feature expansion and cross-platform consistency

    high · Host: 'The functionality is why they need the new UI... it is bursting. You can't put any more into that UI'

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.065

0:00
So Farsight announced some screenshots of Fireball and El Dorado. So I started reading the comments, and by and large, people are going, Yay, EMs and the return of electromagnetic machines or electromechanical. Excuse me, I always want to say EMP for electromagnetic. Anyway, don't know where my head is at these days. Anyway, so there was a lot of fantastic, this is awesome. And then started the Eldorado. Don't we already have Eldorado? Which is followed by, oh, they're just doing the cheap way out and stuff. I can tell you by playing the beta, it plays differently. It looks way better. You don't have the annoying background sound. I will be playing Eldorado way more than I ever play City of Gold. Basically, the only reason why I'd ever play City of Gold again is if it pops up as a table of the week at some point in the future. Yeah, me too. It's an annoying game. Yeah, annoying.
1:04
Yeah. Whereas this EM version, way better, much improved. So, yeah, I wouldn't be complaining about that. On the subject of the EM pack, it is in beta at the moment on Google as well. But unfortunately, there have been some build issues with it. So we can't test it at the moment. We can't actually access the table carousel. It crashes the game. So I know that Fastlight's fully aware of it, and I'm sure they'll get onto it immediately on their Monday. I think Scott's been working super hard lately. He posted a build on his Saturday, I think. So the guy is being slammed. So I'm not really being particularly harsh on the comments at the moment because I know the poor guy is just being absolutely massacred there at the moment. I don't know what they've got him doing, but he burned the candle at both ends for sure. So, yeah, keep on trucking, Scott.
2:01
So where the silly comments came in, though, was when people go, oh, well, I wouldn't have bought a season pass if I had known those were going to be in. Oh, really? I'm like, really? For two tables? Of the ten releases, you're getting two tables in one month. that happen to be EMs and you're going to complain and think that like one person goes, Oh, I would have bought all a cart then. I'm like, you're essentially getting the table for free. We've already discussed this words. Yeah. If you're going to buy six tables, the other four wind up being free. So it's like, come on. Exactly. Whinging people. I was going to say something else, but yeah. And then I saw a comment that was again, semi-related to the EMs, but where the person said, I'm not buying another table until you guys release 8-Ball Deluxe. Okay, sure. Have a nice time with that. Exactly.
@ ~22:00
Pinwize
person
Zen Pinballproduct
The Addams Family (Kickstarter)game
Terminator 2game
Twilight Zonegame
Star Trekgame
Eight Ball Deluxegame
The Addams Family Goldgame
Simpsons Pinball Partygame
Doctor Whoproduct
BlahCade Pinball Podcastorganization
  • ?

    gameplay_signal: El Dorado remake shows significant improvements over original City of Gold table including better visuals and audio design

    medium · Host: 'I can tell you by playing the beta, it plays differently. It looks way better. You don't have the annoying background sound'

  • ?

    product_launch: Dark River Kickstarter experiencing perception issues about engagement despite being early in campaign; pattern from previous Kickstarters creating anxiety

    high · Host: 'The last Kickstarter was down to the line... Terminator 2 was right at the edge of it... enthusiasm level drops every single time'

  • $

    market_signal: Stern developing competing pinball app; signals fundamental shift in platform strategy that excludes Stern content from Farsight long-term

    high · Host: 'There's a Stern app being developed... Any Stern release from now on isn't going to be through the Farsight app'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Hosts express frustration with pattern of Zen Pinball player boycotts over leaderboard and control tweaks viewed as disconnected from actual gameplay impact

    medium · Host: 'What are you playing the game for? Are you playing the game because you're a leaderboard whore? Or because you actually enjoy playing pinball?'

  • ?

    operational_signal: Scott Denise at Farsight described as overworked, posting builds on weekends; indicating potential staffing or project management issues

    medium · Host: 'Scott's been working super hard lately... the guy is being slammed... burned the candle at both ends for sure'

  • ?

    community_signal: Recurring troll activity on Kickstarter comments requiring bans; hosts argue for proactive moderation rather than reactive cleanup

    medium · Host: 'Same comments... same thing that happens every single Kickstarter... it took about two days... Those two days, the damage is massive'

  • ?

    marketing_signal: Farsight criticized for insufficient targeted marketing to Doctor Who fan communities; generic press release approach instead of IP-specific audience engagement

    high · Host: 'Farsight relies too much on community to do outreach... didn't mention the app symbol... standard press release... not appealing directly to Doctor Who'

    • 3:01
    Oh, really? Oh, really? Sorry. What a threat. Oh, jeez. We'll just drop a whole schedule for the season and go and get that table right now for you because it's really important to you. Yeah, thanks.
    3:12
    Yes, yes, because your $4.99 is going to make or break the table. Yeah, absolutely. for sure it's a great table and I think last time when you were speaking to Norman I think you've made him realize it's a great table so fingers crossed we will get that at some point but it's those empty threats that you just kind of go what are you even playing the game for then I don't understand it was my comments that had to do with certain people names will be not mentioned that were boycotting Zen because they had messed with the leaderboards. Really? So what are you playing the game for? Are you playing the game because you're a leaderboard whore? Yeah. Or because you actually enjoy playing pinball? Yeah, what's your motivation? Are you just like, is your ego bigger than your pinball flipper fingers? Or what is going on here? You know?
    4:05
    Right, right. And then it was and it became a thing where it was oh, well they tweaked the nudge and so the nudge doesn't work the same on Steam as it does on mobile. and again I'm like well what are you really bouncing back and forth between the two most people tend to stick with one platform but then I think it became oh well that was affecting the leaderboards again well the leaderboards I don't think they're actually common they're actually split up through platform I really don't know I don't know what the complaint for boycotting made zero sense to me they often do It just falls into the silly complaint department where you're like, you're not affecting them in the least.
    4:52
    There are better ways of complaining and getting your point across. Right, because the minute you say, I'm not going to be a customer, that means they don't have to please you anymore. Okay, good. No, that's one less person we have to worry about. See you.
    5:07
    Right. Yeah please feel free to just like throw away your Zen Pinball app or uninstall it from Steam as well while you at it and lose all the in purchases that you spent money on because you know clearly you don want to play the game anymore and it offending you So make sure you uninstall everything as well No refunds So that rolls me into the new UI comments regarding the new UI being beta with Farsight where people are going, well, I don't want this new UI. I want to stick with the old one. People, too bad. They're moving on for a reason. Why would you want to stick to the old one? Because they like the look of it. And this is what's so funny is everybody's getting hung up on the look. Nobody's talking about the functionality, or very few people are talking about the functionality. The functionality is why they need the new UI. All the things that people start going, well, why don't they just put this in and then I'd be happy? And it's like, because it's full. You can't put any more into that UI. It is bursting. I use the analogy of, it's basically you're living in a small apartment, and you're now having to keep your clothes in the kitchen drawers because you've already run out of space elsewhere.
    6:14
    Case in point, I don't know, So you won't have seen this in the new UI, of course, because you probably got it on by default. But in the old UI, they've tried to promote the Kickstarter in the What's New section on mobile, and it cuts off the text. There's just no room to put anything in that part of the UI. And this is just one of the aspects of it. Like, I've written the Android user guide to work around the old UI because it's just so terrible. and you know it's it needs to go it's so tired and so old and you will be foolish to think as a user that the old ui is better you may like the old ui because you're not used to the new ui but trust me but as a person that hasn't even used it yet it's not going to take you long to get used to it because i've seen screenshots and it looks pretty intuitive to me right Right. I mean, there are, there's a few complaints that I even have with the intuitive of this because it's making you, for instance, you click on the table. That doesn't start the table. That just selects the table. Now you've got to move your cursor down to the start button and push that. Well, it should just be a double click. Yeah. Think it's double click. And then you're like with mobile, it's like tap. And if you're using a controller, they've done it even better where you just press the a button on your controller when you select a table and it just starts like you just go and that's and that's what it should be and that's part of the the complaint that people have with the look is they're either saying it looks like it's something out of the 90s which no that's what the old ui was and or they're saying that it's well no it's clearly designed for a touch market for a touch screen and i'm like well how different does it really need to be for the controller i don't This is like people complaining that, oh, this gameplay is like crap with a controller when it's a point-and-click game made for mouse and keyboard. There are certain sacrifices that have to be made, but one of the complaints that people were talking about was that they were like, well, I have to use my mouse. I can't use my controller for everything. I'm sitting there going, yeah, I've got my controller right here. I'm able to fully cruise around the entire UI. I don't know what you're talking about. But it's just a matter of instead of using the analog stick to move the cursor, I have to use the D-pad. Yeah, it's all wired in there. It's like, did you not try? Did you not try the other thing to see if it worked and moved it around?
    8:45
    I've yet to have to use my mouse in the new UI. Maybe it's an education thing. It's one of these things where I think it's an education thing, but it's also people are so stuck in their ways they refuse to try and figure out. You've got to remember, too, this thing's in the order. Like, it's not the GA of the UI. Like, if there's something wrong that you are finding it hard to use, well, don't just say, I don't like it, because that's going to get ignored. Say, I don't like it because this and this and this, and I think if you improved it by doing this, you know, there's a way to give feedback, people, and I think a lot of people just don't get how to actually give constructive criticism.
    9:25
    Well, my favorite comments then wind up being, oh, I could whip this up. I could whip up a way better looking UI in two days. Off you go. Okay.
    9:33
    Well, no, it's not. Here's my thing. Great. You can whip it up and make it look good. Now can you make it function? Yeah. Now wire it in and see how easy it is. Off you go. Because that's the tricky part. Yeah. It's people. They're trying for a consistent look across all the platforms and to make it functional completely within those over multiple pages of, of data bouncing back and forth. it just really is like come on people really quit being the developer or haven't worked with developers in the past don't make comments about how easy or how easy it isn't to do something because you have no idea yeah stop it yeah exactly those comments as well because you know i am i'll openly admit i'm not a developer but i'll also openly admit that i know my way around software as a technical writer and as a beta tester. And I can make semi-informed decisions about things. And I know approximately how long it would take to do things based on working closely with developers. So when I see these broad-reaching comments that these mouth-breathers are saying, it just makes me furious because they not being respectful to the developers that have to actually implement this And I just want to slap them down in the forum But I restrain myself because I a better person than that But I'm telling you now, if you listen and you make stupid comments in the forum, I'm sitting behind my screen going, you're a dickhead. You don't know what you're doing. You don't know what you're talking about. So stop it.
    11:07
    And then the last part was silly complaints. And actually, some of these are valid. it all revolves around the Kickstarter for Dark River and mainly it's the exact same complaints we've heard in previous Kickstarters which this is where it falls kind of in Farsight's lap because I pointed it out to them I said people complain about the exact same things every single time and I think Farsight's attitude is well we've been successful four times already what do we really need to change and I'm like well the enthusiasm level drops every single time, though, and it becomes dicier and dicier. The last Kickstarter was down to the line, wasn't it? Like, it wasn't a roaring success like Twilight Zone or Star Trek. No, Terminator 2 was the one that was right, right at the edge of it, whereas Adam's Family, you know, didn't have that much of an issue. I mean, it went to the final week, but it was never, oh my god, is it going to or is it not? The thing that I find just hilarious on the subject of whinging entitled people, it's the people go, oh gee, I wish it was the Simpsons pinball party. Why are they doing this table? It's like, you do realize that there's one of these every year, pretty much. You can pretty much guarantee that Farsight will do one kickstarter table every year. Stop whinging about what you like and what you don't like. I think you've made your point pretty clear that you want the Simpsons Pinball Party. I think far so I know fully that Simpsons Pinball Party is something that should be on their radar unless they're completely unresponsive or what's the word? If they can't take feedback on board, which I know that, really, come on. Everyone wants a table. So you don't need to keep pushing a point. Seriously. Well, the other thing is, use your head. Use some logic in this. There's a Stern app being developed. Yeah, exactly. Where do you think that table is going to land? Yeah.
    13:13
    Any Stern release from now on isn't going to be through the Farsight app. Right. Let's be serious here. Right. Stern may as well be off the table for TPA as part of their product release. Common complaints. The rewards aren't compelling. I won't even get into... Let's just say they cannot put TAF gold as a reward. I think there's licensing issues.
    13:42
    Which is just a shame because it would drive sales. But we both know that. And if they can't do it, they can't do it. It would drive sales. And I got into huge arguments about why it should be released for a low price. I saw those. Oh, my God. I read them. I'm going, yep, your arguments are valid. And, yeah, I couldn't really agree with the other one. very frustrating. It was very frustrating. Yeah.
    14:10
    Um, because some of those compelling rewards that people are talking about is they want this absolute exclusivity of, well, why don't you make us some tables? Yeah. Because that doesn't cost any money. Um, so you want to like make a table, like what they're suggesting for people who haven't read the thread is, yeah, you make us a table and, uh, you only release it as part of entitlement for the Kickstarter and no one else gets it. So maybe for people that are like a hundred dollar, $250 backers too. Yeah. So based on past historical record, that's about 400 people. Um, so 400 people would have access to this table. Yeah. Not on your life, sport. Oh, that's not going to happen. Really? That is, it's, it's just a very elitist view really. And you know, that kind of entitlement really annoys me. I use the argument that it's a, you know, you have a Ferrari and suddenly Ferrari's become available for everybody. And now you hate your Ferrari. It's not because the car changed. It's just because the availability changed. You know, it's like, it's not that the car got any worse because suddenly it was massively available. So anyway, the other thing, like I really wish Farshad would use cafe press for their merch. It's rubbish. Um, and it, I would like to get a Pimbala cage shirt. Honestly, I would, but I'm not getting it through cafe press. And so having the upper levels as Cafe Press merch does not entice me one little bit. It's like, nope. In fact, I would actually go, no, not going to back at that level. Yeah. I know the quality of Cafe Press is shizer. Well, and people had a good point, though, with there is a ton of Doctor Who merch. And why they couldn't tap in readily available. why they couldn't tap into the BBC, if the BBC could help offer some things.
    16:02
    It is one of those things where you just kind of go, really, this is what the rewards are? But again it doesn shock me in the least that these were what the rewards were because I knew that it was going to be like this before it even happened I do think a valid complaint is that Farsight relies too much on the community to do the outreach for them They really do.
    16:25
    Yeah, I mean, on Twitter, when they announced it, they hashtagged some BBC stuff, but they didn't put the app symbol. The app symbol is what attracts... They didn't mention it.
    16:39
    So in my own post, I quickly just put at BBC. All of a sudden, all these BBC things came up. So I was like, okay, BBC, BBC America. And I typed in at Doctor Who and all of a sudden all these Doctor Who things, Doctor Who News and Doctor Who this and that. So I just attached a whole bunch of those. It's like it's not that terribly difficult. But it did seem like, oh, you're relying on us to do that outreach. I saw one posting that apparently they did reach out to Doctor Who News, and the thing that was released on Doctor Who News was completely just a standard press release, you might say, from Farsight. It wasn't appealing directly to Doctor Who. It was virtually the exact same thing that you would see on the Kickstarter page. This whole thing, the whole thing about Kickstarter, it's selling the concept, selling the idea. Exactly. You've got to sell the sizzle, not the sausage. Yeah. like it's it's got to be targeted advertising for each audience and you know the chances are that you know the people on doctor who forums may not be big fans of pinball you've got to appeal to what they do so they will actually go you know what i want this piece of doctor who memorabilia in the fact that it's a it's a table and a snapshot in time i saw some people coming you know well it doesn't have all the doctors in it you're no kidding because it was produced in 1993. Right.
    18:02
    It's not a 2015 table. It's a piece of history, which is why it's important. I do laugh also. It's only been a week that the Kickstarter has been going, and yet the perception is that, oh, well, Farsight's not engaging enough with everybody. And this is where I told Farsight, I said, it's a holdover from the previous Kickstarters. it's you unless you have something today which again we always record on Sundays unless there's something up right now that is a new brand new update people start worrying and start going oh boy it just comes back to the well this is what happened last time we didn't get any updates we didn't get anything we didn't get told stretch goals we didn't get this we didn't get that it's a rolling snowball getting larger and larger and you have a shorter amount of time to eliminate that so it's already started I mean it was started three days into the Kickstarter so it's again it's that perception that people have that I'm not quite sure Farsight is taking seriously enough or even aware that this is the perception exactly and then as always the trolls are apparently back in the comment section of the Kickstarter and why it takes so long to boot these people. I have no idea. I haven't been following it. I only, all of a sudden, it trickles into the forum, and then PinWiz freaks out and tells everybody that they're accountably deleted if they don't shut up about it.
    19:38
    But it's the same comments. It's the same thing that happens every single Kickstarter. And it's like, why is this not so readily viewable?
    19:49
    You see that person's name you know exactly what they're going to say, ban them. Yeah, just insta-ban them. Block them from a comment.
    19:59
    It's simple. There's moderation tools, I'm sure, on Kickstarter that will allow you to block usernames.
    20:04
    So just block them. Well, apparently it has been now, but it took about two days. Yeah, it was there for far too long. Those two days, the damage that it does is massive. And again, this goes into the being interactive with your own Kickstarter. Had you been monitoring it every hour. No, it's not checking on it every three days or something like that. You need to be checking in on it every two hours, if not more. Exactly. And seeing what people are saying so that you can interact with them then and there. Because most people, if they post a comment and they check back a half an hour later and there's no posting to their comment, They go, I'm never getting mid-answered. And that makes them feel like they're not worthy of it. And yet these are the very people that are kicking money in because you can't comment unless you've kicked money in. So it's like you need to be nurturing these people. You need to be making them feel cool about their expenditure so that they'd be willing to maybe even pitch in more. But instead what happens is they get angry. You can bet the trolls kicked in one buck so they can just start commenting and trolling. It's like, well, thanks for your buck, mate. See you later. They kicked in one buck, and then they'll pull their buck a week later after they've had their fun, and then that buck never existed. Yeah, that's right. Virtual bucks. Yeah. What a motherbucker.
    21:30
    There's the title of the show right there, Motherbucker. Thanks for listening to The Back Room, and make sure you listen to the podcast next week.