Oh, would you look at the time? It's 15 minutes past Dre, and that means it's time to collectively come together. Grab your spot on the carpet, get in your carpet square, grab your paper towel and your paste, because we're about to snack on some pinball. This is the We Are Pinball Podcast. Myself, Don, joined by Cengiz, Retro Cengo as well, as well as a special guest, which we are super enthusiastic to get to, a guy you know and love well, whose voice is even more velvety smooth than mine, will be joining us in just a moment. Cengiz, how you doing? I'm doing great, my friend. I'm enjoying the snow in Denmark, and today we have got a great, great guest on. I have been asking this guy to join us for a couple of weeks now, and we were just about to have him on the show, and something happened. We got a Street Fighter II champion character called... Kel Hernandez instead. Oh, that's true. I remember that. He just scooped it. A street fighter. Those pinball people from Arizona, though, they are definitely a breed. Yeah, man. You know how it is. But today we've got a great, great guest, and his name is Retro Roam. Wow, that's a pretty good intro, man. I like it. I felt like Michael Buffer, like the Let's Get Ready to Rumble guy. That's pretty exciting. Thanks for having me, guys. I know we've gone back and forth a lot, but it's been tough with work and stuff, so I'm glad we were able to make it work. Yeah. Ralph, welcome to the WAP team. You have been official a WAP right now. It's so good to have you here. We're so excited about this show. It's an hour-long show. We're going to talk about pinball love and passion all the way from the U.S. to Denmark, and this is so cool because Ralph and Donnie, you guys are very popular in the U.S., but after this show, you will be internationally recognized in Europe. That gets a drop. It's going to be so cool, man. So I'm excited. How are you guys feeling? After the day that we had yesterday, we have to pause for just a moment and thank our brand-new producer of the WAP Pinball Podcast. You may know him as Josh Cox, but he better goes by his stage name of Velvet Steve because he's amazing for joining us at the $50 producer level, gets him a golden invitation into our green room basically whenever he wants. He can sleep on my couch. He can date my cousin, even though his wife Gwen probably would not approve that. I'm just so ecstatic. How do I stop fangirling about Josh here? I mean, come on, man. We have to – okay, okay. So yesterday – Hey, Don, if Josh is single, like, what's this cousin look like? Do we get any – I mean, you know, he might be interested in taking you up on that. Long brunette, nice legs, name's Bruce, full beard, but let me tell you. Damn it. Salt of the earth, this guy. So yesterday, yesterday, bam, we got a notification, right? And it says Ron L joins the Patreon and he supports us. So Don and I, we called up each other and said, another supporter, this is so cool. And Don was like, yeah, man, we made this show. We actually uploaded the show. It was like a 30-minute long show yesterday. only for Patreon, and we opened up and talked so much about American Pinball. Don has played the upcoming game, and all the details are there. I mean, come on in and join, right? So Ron L., he joins. So it's so cool. Welcome, Ron. Thank you for supporting us. Like five minutes later, okay, we got this message. Josh Cox. Now this guy has been supporting us at the $5 level for a couple of weeks, And then he just pumps it up to 50 bucks. And we're like, what? There's like 10 new supporters in one day. And he writes this. Thanks for the shout out, guys. I'm going to upgrade my membership because of this. I would listen to you guys talk about pain swatch. That was my favorite part. If you keep out this level of enthusiasm. Makes me want to visit Denmark. I'm going to need you to tell my wife, Gwen, it is not tacky to add more machines into the collection. First of all, Gwen, John Cox is absolutely right. These pinball machines, they multiply. We love to buy more and more and more. Look at Donnie. From one day to another, he bought like 22 pinball machines. So they just multiply. If Josh Cox has under 50 pinball machines, then just allow him to buy another one. We hear that he's really interested in Evil Dead, so let him just get an Evil Dead. I cannot wait. Another new game I've played. We're going to talk about that also. But then five minutes later, what happened? Another person, company, supported us on Patreon. Who was that, Donnie? That was Spooky Pinball Zone's Spooky Luke, kind of the lead designer for Evil Dead, jumped in the chat and said, you know what, you guys? I got to hear what you got to say, man. Oh, man. So Team Spooky, welcome to the team also. So cool you're supporting us. But this means our Patreon talk 2.0, we cannot trash talk Spooky anymore. Damn it. Damn it. It is what it is, man. Okay, thank you, guys. It's so cool. So when we have a guest on, we have this game that's called Who's Your Daddy and What Does He Do? So we're going to ask Retro Ralph here. First of all, when did you enter the pinball hobby, Ralph? So, okay, officially, I would say my official introduction to like, wow, I can't believe that these things are still being made, was a buddy of mine said, hey, you know, because he was an arcade buddy because I always did all the arcade restoration stuff. And he goes, hey, I think this year you should come with me to Pinball Expo. And it was the year that they that they brought the show back after the pandemic. So it was the year Godzilla was there. And I I just fell in love. I was like, oh, my gosh, I was just amazed at, number one, all the people there that were super passionate about pinball, you know, because so I was like, wow, this is crazy because, you know, I had gone to a lot of arcade shows and yeah, sure. There's enthusiasm, but there also are not really new arcade games outside of like the stuff that goes into like a Dave and busters and big FEC locations. So I was like, I was like hooked. I'm like, Oh my gosh, like everyone is this excited. So I started playing and keep in mind, imagine not playing pinball for like 20, 30 years and then jumping on Godzilla and being like, what the hell is this? Like, you know, I was like, Holy shit, man. Can I swear on the show a little bit? Absolutely. All the way. I was like, holy crap, this is amazing. So when I got back, that was when I bought my first pinball machine, which was Jurassic Park. I bought a Jurassic Park Pro. And then to your point, I don't remember if we were on air or not. I think we were on air, where you said they multiply, and it just multiplied from there. Why did you choose Jurassic Park first? Honestly, I really wanted to choose Deadpool first. and uh at the time you couldn't get one i couldn't find one anywhere and um i don't know at the time this was still when you could like buy a new in box pinball machine and basically sell it for what you paid for it so i got lucky enough to still experience that for a little bit that's only one yeah yeah and there was a guy locally who was like hey i'm getting rid of jurassic park and keep in mind i knew nothing about modding them or doing anything but i'm i was i was very like familiar with like electronics and doing that from the arcade world so it didn't like you know turned me off much, but he's like, yeah, it already has a shaker motor and art blades. And I did all this stuff. I was like, oh, cool. And I don't know, it just happened to be a good deal. And Jurassic Park was a game I had played at Pinball Expo too. So I was like, oh, that's a fun one. So I can't really go wrong. Oh, nice. So you started with an L-Wing game. That's, that's so cool, man. So let me hear, you have a collection now. So when you have a collection, you're a collector, you're a pinball guy, you're in it. How many games do you have in your collection and is it enough well it's never enough i mean come on now come on that's never enough so there's so there's six and i and i'm and i'm very excited because i haven't even shared this with my own audience yet is i finally got my first non-stern non-new game so i got a williams game i got a terminator 2 yeah i'm really excited about that but yeah there's six and technically it's so cool let's hear your whole collection what do you have? I had a Godzilla the original but then when the black and white came out I personally like I know there's people are 50-50 split on that I just flipped out when I saw it because I got to see it actually I met Don for the first time at Southern Fried Gaming Expo that's right and that was the like unofficial unveiling of it you know like they showed it there but that was before Comic-Con, I think, right? Yeah. Was it Comic-Con where they officially showcased it? Yeah. Anyway, so I did sell my color for the black and white. So I have a Godzilla black and white. That's a premium, or, you know, it's the only one they came in. But, yeah, so it's a premium, but I did all, you know, some mods to it and stuff. A John Wick LE. You know, I'm one of those morons that has a complete idiot who bought a John Wick LE. Rushed in, man, head first. Same, same. X-Men LE. Metallica Remastered Premium Hell yeah Jaws Premium which I made look like a fake LE I love the other energy stuff and then the Terminator 2 so that's the whole collection as it stands right now so what did you make choose or buy a Terminator 2 because you're new usually new people they really want to buy Stern games so my only Are you an Arnold fan? Come on! First of all, to me, it is in the top five best action movies of all time. Of all time. There's no debating it. Of all time. Edward Furlong was a legitimate street urchin that they discovered and put in that film to play a street urchin. Loved it. I just listened to him on a podcast with Steve-O. It's amazing. Yeah, so I mean, there was that. And then, oh, sorry, what was your question again? Sorry, I got excited. Why did you choose? Because there are so many Bella Williams games out there. I'll do this very quickly. So my sister went to school in Syracuse University in New York. That's where she went to college. And I was still younger then. So I would have been like maybe I probably wasn't a teenager yet. Maybe I was like I can't remember how old I was exactly. But I always hated going to visit her at college. I hated it. There was nothing for me to do. We drive up as the family with my grandparents and it was super boring, even though I love my grandparents. But so we get there and I'm bored out of my mind, like doing all the normal stuff. It was like parents weekend or something. And I was I was like trying to find something to do. And there was a break room on her floor and on her floor. The only thing in there was a Terminator 2 pinball. So I actually am nostalgic for it. And I remember like just staying in there the whole time. But think about it, at that time, that movie had just, because I think the pinball machine was technically developed right before the movie, right? So it wasn't really developed as the movie came out, I don't think. Because didn't the movie come out in 92? And the game was technically like... I think the movie was from 91. Was it 91? Yeah. Well, anyway, I was like, this is amazing. Because you think about it, as a kid, you're playing this and Arnold's voice is in it. I was like, this is freaking amazing. Shoot here and here. I was like, get out and all this I was like, oh my gosh, it's the best shit ever Get out I mean, the summer of 1991 July 3rd, 1991 Yeah, I remember that summer Terminator was everywhere Movie, film, everywhere Boss, everywhere Also the arcade game with the machine gun Everywhere, and all the cinemas Everywhere, it was just Terminator If I want to relive one year in my life It should be 1991 yeah 91 i mean the only the only uh clip audio clip i wish they put in the game i don't know why it makes me laugh it didn't make me laugh as a kid but when he's like gets off the phone he's like your foster parents are dead i don't know why like it would be so awesome if they put that in there because it shouldn't make me laugh but the way he says it he's like they're dead kids sorry just like when you quick drain after a plunge yeah poor john connor man i love it How's Wolfie? That's the movie I learned my English from. So, you know. I freaking tell. It's awesome. Yeah, that's it. I had heard when they did the German dub of that movie, they used a different voice actor because Arnold's German accent, his natural one, is really redneck sounding to native German speakers. And the fact that he's like an Austrian hillbilly sounding like to German speakers is hilarious to me. Can I ask you guys something that I don't know? Like I really would like to know. because I just put the pin sound soundboard in there and all that stuff. And I'm running the alternative, the like newer soundtrack that has the, you know, the movie soundtrack. Who's doing the Arnold voice? Is it actually Arnold? No, no. It's just a guy that sounds a lot like Arnold. Yeah, yeah. Okay, all right. Do you know who it is? Is it like some guy that does pinball stuff or is it just some rando that sounds like Arnold? It depends on which package you download it because some of those packages, they use direct clips from Arnold interviews or from the movies. So it depends on if it's something from the movies, then it's a clip from Arnold's voice. But if it's something like shoot the left ramp or something, then it's not Arnold. Okay, all right. We'll have to talk offline about that then. My brother wants me to hook up with American Pinball. No, not American. Pinball Brothers. And give my voice for Arnold for their upcoming game, Predator. Oh, yes. Dude, so wait. We're actually – I heard this. So we're actually going to get a real Predator finally that is available. That's kind of cool. It's the best, man. Okay, Terminator 2 is just my favorite, but Predator. But, guys, I feel like – do you guys have anything against – if one company has made a game, another company makes it after, Do we have something against, you know, Jersey Jack made, you know, Rock and Roses or Pirates or whatever? Isn't it okay? Yeah, yeah. Especially if it's good, yeah, or if it's better. So the rumors are that, you know, Pinball Brothers are making Predator, but I feel like Spooky Pinball should make it also. Oh, man, yeah. Because right now in 2024, I feel like Spooky Pinball is number one on theme integration. That's just how I feel. they just integrate the theme like amazingly so I've been talking to Bug about this and people are thinking Bug is only for you know chop people's heads off kind of movies he's not he's also into those Arnold classics like Commando Predator you know stick around so when he throws the knife that's a great great part of that movie like that's when you just You know how to be a... Cool, man. All right. We want to hear top three retro-relved wish lists on pinball machines. Which three games could you get if you could clips your fingers? Oh, man. That's a really hard one because they're probably going to be mostly new games. But one I've been wanting for a while, and I keep going back and forth. I don't know why. Like I've literally almost bought it probably five or six times. I really want a Pulp Fiction. I fell in love with Pulp Fiction. I know Don has one. I fell in love with it when I was at Pinball Expo, whatever like 10 years ago when they showed it at Pinball Expo, whenever that was. It seemed like forever ago. But I love that game. It's just such a fun game. You know, there's a lot of like older. I play at Electric Bat as my tournament night down in Phoenix, and they have a lot of old games. So it's hard for me to pick because so many of them I really, really like. I've been playing a lot of Jackbot. I had a lot of fun with Jackbot. I don't know if I'd want to own it, though, but it's definitely one of those ones where I played it quite a bit and I'm like, hmm, I could get behind owning a Jackbot maybe. It's a cool game. I'm trying to think of one other one that I really want. I played Tales from the Crypt at the bat and then I ended up getting one. Yeah, that's a great one too. Yeah. Well, one of them I just got So when I go there, I always play their Terminator 2 And I'm like, finally I'm going to have one So I was really excited about that They got a lot of weird stuff there though They have like Andromeda, I don't know if you've ever played that game There's not that many of them, there's only like 500 of them made And who knows how many are left That's a fun one too But it's like completely off the wall Sinbad is really fun Have you ever played Sinbad? It's got like If you lift the flippers The ball will actually drain in between Oh, those suicide flippers, yeah. I don't know. Honestly, I feel bad that I can't really answer this because I feel like there's so many games I would want that it's hard to just hone in on one or two. Total Nuclear Annihilation is another one I really enjoy. Whenever I go to the bat, my buddy and I, after the tournament, play that. We do our own tournament on TNA because that game is pretty hard, actually. Yeah. But it makes you want to keep playing it. You literally just want to keep playing it because it pisses you off because it's so hard. I don't know. I know that's not the best list ever, but TNA would be great. Pulp Fiction would be great. And then I think the third one could be like any bunch of like older games that that list is pretty long. But Whirlwind, I finally logged a little bit. I know we were talking offline on that. I logged a little bit more time on that. That game is very frustrating to me right now, but it's probably because I haven't played it enough. But when all those discs are spinning, you're like, all right, I don't really know where the ball is going to go, but I better be prepared wherever it ends up. so it's on my list at some point too yeah when you have played whirlwind for like 20 30 minutes hours then you know when the discs are spinning they are actually helping you when you know the ball is coming straight down to the middle then you know okay when it goes over this disc it will land on this slingshot or on this flipper after 30 minutes 30 hours you will know but i'm surprised about your list ralph because i have one more real quick just one more okay this this would probably if now i'm kind of really really putting some thought into it if if like i could just get it right now snapping my fingers one that i really love like i really enjoy it is attack from mars like if i could have an attack from mars that would be pretty epic but i think we'll see yeah reminds me of stranger things but uh i think that's probably something everyone says because it's like right left right ramp left ramp and then you have like you know return to battle exchange that with the demogorgon and it's kind of a similar layout and game but classic yeah that's classic uh Brian Eddy yeah but i'm surprised because you have been collecting these for about three years and so cool to hear a guy that has been collected three years is already looking at classic pinball machines because if you give this question to donnie donnie would answer well i have all the games i want but if he should if he should choose three other games. They would probably like some upcoming new stirring games or something. Isn't that right, Donnie? What's on your top three wish list? Well, number one, Diner. Number two, Restored World. That's a great game. Do you really like Diner? Yeah. I have a Frank Frater and a Root Beer. Yeah, dude. Oh my god. Diner for us Europeans, it's so Americana. That back glass, everything. It's so Americana and it's so epic, man. Yeah, I like it. I mean, that was the game when I was 10 years old at the laundromat waiting for the clothes to be done. It was that and Michael Jackson's Moonwalker, and that's what I played. Oh, nice. Yeah, it's got a place, man. Yeah. Okay. So as I'm hearing, that nostalgic feeling is so good. I had this nostalgic feeling a couple of days ago, and you can see in the background, I'm actually building an arcade machine because I was like, I want to play old Neo Geo games. you know those games from 91 92 spin masters and all of that and 20 years back i was huge into arcade i had an arcade shop i sold you know send my joysticks and build cabinet all that stuff you know i did all that stuff until one day i was picking up a new geo game and at the background there were this pinbot from 1986 and i was like what's this and he's like it's a pinball machine And I was like, okay, does it work? I don't know. It was here when I moved in for two years ago. Do you want it? Sure, buddy. So I took it home and started playing. I was like, what? That was it. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, yeah. So I forgot about arcade for 20 years. But now I'm all back. So it's so cool. And we're running seven locations here in Denmark. A lot of pinball machines out there. But pinball machines doesn't make money. When we buy Halo or Fast and Furious Arcade, they make like 40 times more than Iron Maiden. I mean, it is what it is. Yeah, I actually have one game on location, so I'm an operator of one game. So in Electric Bat, I have a Buck Hunter Reloaded. It makes a lot of money, man. Because between tournament play people go over and play it And it actually does really well I glad I did that it was taking up a lot of space in my house and I just asked Cale and Rachel I was like would you guys want this if I put it on location They were like oh yeah the gun games do great here So their two biggest revenue earners outside of their pinball machines is Alien. I can't remember. I always get it confused. It's either Extermination or Armageddon, the big newer one, and then mine, the Buckhunter Reloaded. So when you when you earn enough, use the money to buy one of those. It's called beer or something. The ball comes down and you trickle. Ice cold beer. Ice cold beer. Oh, that's a fun game, man. Put it next to it. You will double up your earnings. That's a good point. I would actually buy one and put it on location if they do it. Hey, if you guys are listening, Gail and Rachel. Yeah, man, it could be so cool. So, again, Retro Ralph, we're so happy to have you here. It's so cool. You guys, you nerds over there, you have any thoughts on the Stern X-Men? Oh, we have thoughts. Who's going to go first? You want to go first, Don? Sure, I'll lead it off. What are your thoughts? Because it has been out now for two months or something. Yeah, like in people's homes, yeah, for that long. So weird, right? What a strange reaction this game has had in the community. Like, you know, I saw the release and I kind of wanted to order immediately. I did wait until I actually played the dang thing before I paid money for it, but that's only because I was able to weasel myself into the factory. I loved everything that I was playing, man. You know, compared to games like Venom where everything's in the back third of the game, this has something stacked in the middle of the game, in the front of the game. It had, you know, a real departure from what we've been seeing. It definitely is not cookie cutter. And then, you know, when it came out, you know, we're dealing with this, you know, launch rattle issue that's going to be mitigated here in a week or so when we get the fix and everything. But it seems like there's been this pushback. Yeah, they said it would be mid-December, and that's kind of where we're at now. There'll be a plastic to keep the ball down in the shooter lane area so it doesn't lose momentum and things rattling around that corner. And then I think a little ball guy in the front and things. But playing the new games with the fix, there was one on location at IAPA. It shoots great. I can hit all the shots. The code reminds me a lot of Foo Fighters where it's hit two shots, Then pick a mode and the mode is Hit these shots of this color and then you finish that When you try to fill them all out I'd like to see what they end up doing with the future So it makes more sense But yeah I think this game should be doing At least as well as Foo Fighters But it's just this weird place In the hobby right now with it Are you thinking about selling your LE? Well that was the plan When it was released I was kind of Already overextended I was planning on buying a premium And I already had a buyer for it so I made it over powder-coated the whole thing. That one shipped out. I ended up getting an LE, too, just because of the exclusivity. They dropped to $800. It looked fantastic, and it does play well. But the plan is to get that one out, too, because I'm still kind of above my self-imposed limit. So I will be looking for a buyer here soon for it. But in the meantime, I still think it's a fun game to play. How are the prices there for the LE? Have you checked? Is it over $13 or on the $13? That's the important part. Definitely under. Yeah, definitely under. Yeah. Wow. How do you feel about it, Ralph? Well, you know, it's interesting. When I first got it, I did not play it before I got it. I was really excited. It was funny because I think, I don't know, I definitely got hyped up for it because I love X-Men. So I was like, oh, this is going to be great. And I think if you code aside, it's a very interesting layout. It's very like, I don't know, it's something where I think that when they got together at Stern and probably looked at it initially or looked at Jack Danger's idea of it, they were probably like, oh, crap, this is way a departure from what we've been doing. So I think I like that. I appreciate the fact that they let him be a lot more creative with the game. My problem with it right now, though, is I find myself being bored by the code. The game shoots fun. The shots are so satisfying. When you hit them, they're like, oh, and the ball is doing things in this game that you don't see very often in games. but the problem is like the code itself just is limiting it doesn't feel like there's a lot of depth to it so i hope they resolve that fast because i think that's what a lot of other people are feeling too like that hey if the code could develop more quickly uh they'd probably get more people into it because no one says it's not fun to shoot everyone's like oh my gosh these shots are fun the only thing i don't like is uh is the um the beast lab i i don't know why the beast lab seems useless to me right now, but whatever. It's just because if you miss that left ramp shot, you always hit the B slab if you just miscalculate that shot. It just seems annoying to me, but I don't know. I think they could just do more with it. Like Dawn, I don't know. It sounds like Dawn was going to sell it anyway. I kind of viewed it as a game I would keep, but I hope it turns into a bond where the initial reaction was, oh, the code could be a lot better, and then the code gets so good that people really want to have it and keep it for a long a long period of time. That's what I hope it gets to. I never hope that games fail, obviously. I want them to do well, but I think it needs a lot of work still on the code side of things. Then, of course, the mechanical issues it had. I don't know. I'm a little bit... I might have a different perspective on this because I came from the arcade world where fiddling and tinkering with things is normal. I just think in pinball, sometimes stuff isn't perfect. I do give some leeway to that, but sometimes I get beat up for it, being like, oh, you're too nice to these manufacturers. And it's like, it's a mechanical device with a steel ball in it. Like, it's good. And they all kind of shoot slightly different. So I'm accepting of that, but people give me shit for that. So I don't know. But we want to see innovation, right? We want to see, you know, new things, new risks being taken. And so along with that will be a test and adjust period, you know, and so we're seeing more of it with this than we saw, you know, with Venom, which was, you know, worked out of the box. There just wasn't that much in it, right? you know so there wasn't much to fail there um you know but i i see this game landing and being at least as good as foo fighters the layout seems even more innovative than foo fighters was code seems similar right now and i'm sure you know once they add some extra modes make the future worth something you know when you're playing these modes in the game you're rescuing a x-man from death who then like joins the team so when you go to the future they would be dead but now they're not so there's got to be like perks that come if you you know save wolverine or if you save storm when you get to the future. There should be something, a different light show, different modes, an extra ball save or something, the action button will add an extra ball or something. Like that should be coming. And I can't imagine they haven't thought of this as well. So, yeah, I'm waiting for the code to flourish on this one. Layout's fun. You know, so you fix the plunge issue and then I think we should be good. Do you think that's why the prices are dropping on the X-Men? It's a brand new game. It's got to just have to do with the uncertainty too. Like, no one knows what's going to happen. You know, they're fearing, like, the risk of it being a falling knife. And if they don't get out now, then they're going to be regretting it. Maybe. Yeah, I don't see. It's because of another game that I want to ask you your thoughts about. Maybe it's because of Metallica Remastered. Oh, my God. Oh, man. Maybe because of that, you guys have got the Metallica. We only have the older version. We have the loser $5,000 LE now. I'll do all the old games. How was the new game? Ralph, you just unboxed yours, posted. Donnie, you just posted, unboxed. How do you feel? Are you happy with the purchase? I took half the day off work yesterday to invite my friend over so we could play it. We played the heck out of it. We were having so much fun. And here's the thing. I have those other games in my game room. We only took breaks to play T2. We didn't play anything else. We were having so much fun. it's just so good like i didn't play the original one that much but they do have it at the at one of the places i played uh tournament play at so i'm i'm fairly familiar with it but i to me they took the original concept and just made it even better i love the game like it is so fun to play it's it's you're smiling the whole time there's it's just i don't know how you can not like it it's a little bit of like chopping wood as you play it because there's like things you have to do to progress but oh my gosh it's so fun like i don't know how you can not have fun with that game Unless you just hate Metallica maybe, but even still, even if you hated Metallica, it'd still be fun. That live show. It's just next step. We have the LED, but I actually had, when it came out, I had the pro version, and the pro versions came with normal bulbs. They didn't have LEDs inside. Yeah. And later on, they got upgraded to LED, blah, blah, blah, but still one color pro. But this is just rock concert. It's awesome. It's so awesome. My only issue I'm having with it is those – I haven't been online much on Pinside and some of these other places, but I've got to figure out how to fix my drop targets. Sometimes they just brick off of them. It's almost like if you hit the ball lightly there, they'll drop easily. But if it's coming fast, they brick off of the drop targets, and they don't actually drop. So I've got to figure that out. Try the old version. That's even worse. Oh, is it really? But there's a fix for it, right? I think people were saying some adjustments you can make. If you get in there and you attach the spring a couple of rungs lower so there's more tension on it, it becomes more responsive. But honestly, as I've been playing it, it's become less of an issue. The first five games I played on it, it was bad. That middle drop target, it took five times to get it to drop. Now it seems like more often than not, it's functioning fine. So I would just maybe just break it in. Touch it. It'll just keep playing it. Yeah, yeah. That's what I did. I had to adjust the ball guides. in yeah just the ball got just slightly on the orbits because the balls were catching the corner of the sling and after doing that now they come directly back to the flipper it's so much fun to like like learn all this where all the shots are on those flippers be able to hit them on command almost like you're calling your shots and in that game when you're you know one ball away from a multiball one ball away from an extra ball like it's you're one shot away it's like that's exactly what you need to be able to do well and there's that like stress on you as a player like i can't mess up like i you don't even have one more one more shot i can't mess this up um sparky's head i'd like to report my sparky's head is attached and doing well like he has not lost his head so that's good people reporting sparky's heads flying off mine has not flown off i don't know about you don but we just jinxed ourselves it's gonna happen this afternoon it's gonna come off i'm gonna go downstairs and play at his head shooting off his body right now i also saw one guy posted the skeleton head on top of the slingshots were felled off it was between his flippers oh no now ralph this game ships in family mode have you gone in there and changed the setting to adult mode i did okay it's yeah it's awesome yes i was like because i didn't tell my buddy and i took because he had come over and played it just for like when we unboxed it because he helped me go get it and uh i didn't know about that mode so then of course when he left that night i started playing with it so i didn't tell him that i turned it on and then you know it says those sayings and And he was just like, dude, did you say that before? I was like, no, we have it on adult mode now. He's like, this is awesome. He's all excited. My balls are on fire, whatever he says. Are you in a Stern loaner program or what's it called? Yeah, it's not really. I feel like a lot of people make – oh, no, I did buy it. I feel like a lot of people make like this, that there's some like super elaborate program. It was just kind of like this thing I think they were trying to do. it's really more of a program through the distributor and they tend to try to market games that aren't doing well so that's the whole thing like if you said to them if I said hey I'd love to check out a Metallica they'd be like yeah cool about that everyone's buying that one here's a game no one wants what loners did you get then Venom Pro well the funny thing is I got a Venom and I fell in love with Venom so that was the first one they gave me was a Venom and I actually really enjoy Venom They gave me the premium. That's a good deal. The deal was like you get it for a month and you have, you know. They didn't actually say, there's nothing elaborate about this program. There's no NDA. There's nothing to sign. They don't even tell you to make content. They're just like, here it is, and if you want to make content, go for it. So it's kind of weird. They probably should put some structure on it a little bit more. But, of course, I made a video on it. So it was Venom. And then the next one they gave me was Bond. and I really, really fell in love with Bond. I'm actually pissed that I sold. So check this out. So they sent me Venom and then I bought it. So they haven't like really, and then they sent me Bond and then I bought it. Then it was Foo Fighters, but I had already owned Foo Fighters and sold it. I don't, I like the band, but the game, I don't know. I just never really fell in love with the game. I know I get, I get sometimes crap for that. I just, I don't know. It was one of those games where I didn't really fall in love with. So those were the three. I'm trying to think if they ever gave me a fourth. I don't think they did. No, because then we got Jaws. That was popular. Oh, my God. They wouldn't give me Jaws through the program, though. They wouldn't let me. What came after Jaws? John Wick. John Wick? No, you already had the John Wick. Yeah, they were like, yeah, cool. They wouldn't send me John Wick, though. Black and white, you already have the black and white. But it's through the distributor, though, so that's what's important. So like basically this marketing firm, 47, I think is the name of it. So they're the one that ran the program to find these creators. Right. I didn't seek them out. They just said, hey, we saw your. It was funny. They pulled up a really old video of mine. It was my Jurassic Park video. OK, we like the way you make content. Would you be interested? Then they connect you with your local distributor, which I already had a relationship with. And then they check that distributor's inventory and they say, OK, you know, so and so distributor, Would you mind loaning this game? And that creator will sort of market the game for you. But there's no, like, rules around it. So I know him. So I was like, oh, well, I'll just give you guys a shout-out in the video. Is that cool? And he's like, yeah, that's cool with me. And the one thing I don't know, I don't know if they give them some incentive to do this. Like, I would think they'd give them some kind of incentive because why would the distributor do it? I mean, other than it's free advertising. But they don't require you to even talk about who the distributor is. so there's got to be some incentive for the distributor but that's the basics of the program it's not really like this super elaborate thing you could probably just go to your distributor and say could I borrow a game if I create content on it and just create your own version of this program you know that's what I'm doing this afternoon yeah that's cool one thing that's not cool is the old Metallica prices with these market trash prices have they really I haven't looked have they really declined now They are unsellable. I mean people are chopping off like 500 bucks every week writing, this is for sale because I ordered the new version. But nobody wants them. Nobody buys them. And on my notes, I have written market crash prices. And right below that, I have written stern price increase. So let's just put this together. So we all know what's happening with the market prices right now, right? If you want to sell a game, it's not easy. I mean, it's really not easy, not here in Europe. I don't know with your market in the U.S. I can see flipping out. Zach, he's posting, you know, just came in, this game, this game, and those prices are amazingly low. I mean, come on, everybody. so but now we're hearing that stern will increase their prices so how do you guys feel about that anyone yeah well you're all going to go for it okay uh well you know i kind of you know not to get political i'm not i'm not a like an economist or anything but uh the only thing i can think of is i was trying to think of this when i heard that rumor i'm like okay if we do have uh additional tariffs, right? If whoever decides to do that does that. When you look at how many things in a pinball machine are actually made in America versus parts that are imported, there's quite a few. There's a lot. Of course, the cabinets, I think, are made in the United States, but you start looking at all the components and a lot of that stuff's not from the United States. So if those components become more expensive, then that would naturally lead me to believe that unless Stern decides to absorb that cost, then games would go up a little bit, unfortunately. And, you know, Stern's not going to absorb the cost. So I don't know. That is unfortunate if that happens because I already feel like we spend a lot of money on these games. And I missed out on the – I wasn't in the hobby when things were probably more affordable. I wish I was because, man, I'd probably have a lot larger of a collection. But, yeah, I think people are going to be bummed out about it. But if a lot of things – here's the good part, I guess. if that drives these companies to find additional avenues to get these parts within the United States for at least the U.S. buyers, then that's cool because maybe the product itself will be more of a homegrown in the United States versus having to import all these parts. But I don't know, like, do we even have the capability or facilities that can create some of these parts we get from China and other places? I don't know. But I mean, it's kind of a bummer. I don't want prices to go up and I'm sure everyone's going to have their opinion on how crappy it is that they're going up. I mean, I don't know. It sucks. Well, the thing is, you can only raise prices and be successful if you're still selling, right? So if prices go up and people aren't buying, it doesn't matter. They could raise prices to $20,000 per machine and they're not going to make any dime more money. So they've got to find a way to bake in some extra value if they're going to be doing that. I liked what they did with Jaws with the LE where at least it came with the shooter rod and it was like an included accessory you know with they've done small things with the premium lines now where they include like the extra angled armor not that that's a huge bond increase any like 20 bucks or something you know but if they start you know if you do pay 13 six for the LE but they give you a voucher for half off the forthcoming topper or something it would soften that blow or they could start coming up with more diverse lines of products we really want that we feel better about purchasing and pad that extra income in other places. Is the rumor, Don, is the rumor only LE or is the rumor just in general? No, it's going to be in general across the board is what it's supposed to be. The rumor that I started and put out there was the 13.6 for the LE because that's what seemed reasonable to me. I think going to 14,000 for an LE seemed like it would be too much. And 13.2, why are you even messing around with that? So $13.6, you know, it's $100 more than $13.5. That's kind of where I wouldn't be surprised if that's what it was. So that's why it seemed likely. And then I started seeing it other places, and I'm wondering if that's just my own echo coming back to me or if I hit on something, you know. I can tell you historically the biggest jump is on the LE. Let's just say $600 or $800, whatever. The biggest jump is on the LE. And if we say LE gets up like $800, then the premium goes up like $400 or $500. And the Pro only jumps $100 every time. So they're really holding the Pro prices low, which is really good because if the Pro gets up, no way. But they're – okay, they had this – with one game I would say this year with Metallica, they had this, oh my god we could have sold thousand more metallicas or whatever you know the le's right so they saw this but i still feel like the timing of this some time back we made a patreon show where i showed where i shared with our patreon people i said to them guys if you have jjp machines in your collection and you're thinking about selling your games sell them right now because JJP will put down prices lower than right now. So our supporters on Patreon, they're like, whoa. And one of them went back and said, thank you, man. I just sold and this is so cool. And now we can see that, what, some of the games are like $2,000, $2,500 cheaper now. I think it's a great thing that JJP is doing. I think all the other companies should do the same. And now hearing about a price increase right now, I think it's ludicrous. I have a proposal for you guys. All right. What if the prices were this? So Pro, $3,999. Premium, $6,999. LE, $9,999. All day. Done. Yeah. I'll take two of each one. Oh, that would be awesome. I mean, a few years back, the LEs were $7,999. Were they really? Yeah. What was a pro? If you go back, back, back, like maybe let's say like not. Probably like $5,000. What was the cheapest though? Like was a pro ever cheaper than $4,000 or was it never? It never got that low. I don't remember on the four, but yeah, between four and five and, you know, So recent years, about five, and then it just bumped up. Ellie's eight, and you could play the Ellie for a year and sell it for 10, for 12. And Canada was like, sternest idiots, they have to take up their prices because the secondary market makes all the money. And then they took up all the prices, and now, sternest idiot, they took up the prices. You know who it is? Oh, talking about Canada. I have a question for you, Donnie. Oh, good. I can't wait. Are you ready? I'm not doing it. I have a question. Oh, Jesus. We know how you feel about Chris Okay Good buddy of mine We have this Patreon section People can support us with and be in the club But if people support us with then they welcome to join our show That's the rule. How about if Chris supports us with $50, what do you want to do? Wait a minute. So why did you just put that out into the ether sphere, man? And Christopher is so influential and so rich. $50 is nothing to him. That wouldn't even fill up half the tank of the demon probably. His lunches are probably more than that. He's probably walking over there right now joining. And then we're going to – I've got to stand by my word. As a member of the WAP society, we would have to do a show. That would be the only fair thing to do. All right. You said it, buddy. I mean, God. But like he's so rich and so influential, like there's no way he wouldn't do that. So I'm going to have to come to terms with it. Chris, if you're listening, just support us with 50 bucks and you have direct access to Donnie. Oh, it's about to get interesting. We'll go to the BBHS tape now. All right. So by the way, before we close off on the pricing thing, so you guys don't believe that the pricing thing has – Is this a preemptive thought because of tariffs, or do you think this is just in general they believe prices need to go up? I'm just curious if you had an opinion on that either way or thought. I think they've been wanting to do this for a while, and they've been finding reasons to hold off on it. And probably John Wick would have been where they would have went, and then they saw the sales. They're like, oh, it's not a good time. But at some point, I think they want to do it. It's a foregone conclusion. You can't forget inflation either. Even if a game was $5,000 10 years ago, that's not $5,000 in today's money. Inflation has impacted. $13,000 today or January 2024 is the same going back eight years as $10,000. That's the same value per purchasing power. That's an apples-to-apples comparison. So if an LE was $8,000 eight years ago, then it has outpaced inflation as far as price inflation or price increase. But you can't ignore that part of it. So I would run it through an inflation calculator before you totally clutch your pearls too hard. But as far as the price increase, I think them as a corporate vision has already had this and has been – it probably already would have gone in if it wasn't for lackluster sales. I think like you said Don I'm kind of like with you on like hey if they bake in some stuff that gives you perceived like some perceived value like let's say they raise the prices and go oh by the way everyone gets at home leaderboards or something else you know something that they add to it even though I probably think they're going to charge for that eventually but you know stuff like that that could help $13,000 throwing a banner with the game put it in the box you know there perceived value you know I know it's It's $36 to have me print a banner, so I can't imagine for them at scale it would be probably half of that. Throw it in there. The LE banner. The LE banner just for the LE owners. You can't buy these or something. But if you guys ask Stern about price increase, they will answer you back, we haven't had a price increase in a long time. It's about time. And usually when they do this, it's with Elwing games. I mean, when we got Godzilla, bam, it jumped from $9 to $10.50. And we were like, that's because there's a camera now, and we have to pay like $10.50 now instead of $9. That camera was just $200 inside a connected thing. But if it's the Elwynn game upcoming, Stern knows everybody's going to buy all the Elwynn LEs. Dungeons & Dragons is not the game to release for the price increase. But who says it's Dungeons & Dragons? I do, and I know, and I'm Nostradamus, and I can see these things. But maybe it's Elwin's King Kong. If I was in charge, it definitely would be. That would be the one to come with the price increase. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. A year after Jaws released. I think it's interesting that they feature games at CES. I used to go to CES all the time, and CES to me was more of like a consumer electronic show. And the gaming aspect of CES was always sort of like secondary. I don't know. Well, now it's not because now they have like VR and stuff like that. But I don't know. I just feel like that's I don't know. I guess I get it. It's an industry show. But we don't mean like their core audience is not at CES. But I guess if I guess because it gets so much media coverage, maybe that's why they do it. But I did attend CES and this was when I wasn't necessarily into into pinball. I did see them launch Stranger Things at the at the CES that I went to in 2019. Maybe that would have been, I think. Yeah. Yeah. So but their section was small. It was like there was a pillar in the building and they just had games around a pillar. The funny thing is I have a video out there where I interviewed Gary Stern, but I was so not into pinball. I was like, Gary, what do you think about virtual pinball? He's like, who the hell sent this idiot over here? And I was doing it live and my audience was calling him Ric Flair and who's the political guy from New Hampshire? Oh, Bernie Sanders. Yeah, they were calling him Bernie Sanders. Oh, no. So my friend is holding the camera, and they were like, he's laughing. I'm like, dude, stop laughing. Like, what are you doing? And Gary had walked away from it, and he's like, they're calling him Rick Flair and Bernie Sanders. I'm like, shut up. I come for you one more time to ask for your purchase of Stranger Things. That's pretty good, Donnie. Oh, my God. Oh, Bernie Flair. Oh, my God. Don't talk about virtual pinball, man. Oh, no. When I brought it up, he's just like, who's this jerk off that's talking about virtual pinball? Talking about virtual pinball on a pinball podcast, you will lose your listeners as fast as talking about pinball tournaments. I mean, they will just shut off. They're just like, I don't know. I'm done. I'm canceling my subscription. I love my virtual machine. We actually got two weeks ago, we got a message from a guy. Donnie, I forgot to tell you about, I don't know if you, but he wrote that he was so happy that we didn't talk about tournament. We should just keep the tournament clean. And he wrote like, some guy with some name won at some place at some tournament that no one cares about. Don't talk about it because this is audio only. We're not there. There's not a YouTube channel. We can't see the footage. It's just so hard for the Average Joe to get some sort of feedback feeling talking about tournaments. And all right, buddy, we will keep tournament talk out of the show. Can you imagine the commentary, Terry, just audio on a pinball game. All right, stepping up to Congo. Ball number two, medium plunge. Skill shot is good and currently trapped up. We'll take a break for our sponsors here. Combo, combo, combo shot. Ball two, lock straight up and down. That's the count. Back to you. God, kill me. So yesterday we uploaded this show, a Patreon show, about American pinball because Donnie has visited American Pinball because there are a lot of crazy rumors about American Pinball, like they're shutting down, they're not selling games, and yeah, crazy rumors. So Donnie was there, and all that info was at Patreon. So usually we will not talk more about it for Patreon viewers only, but yesterday a show came up with David Fix, got interviewed at Loser Kids podcast show. and he had a lot of interesting things to say have you guys listened to that interview? six times so far it was amazing I haven't had a chance to listen to it yet because I got all these goodies all at the same time like Metallica came and the T2 came and this polycade thing that's on the wall behind me came so I had all these toys come at the same time so I have not listened to it at all or much content so I don't know I rely on Donnie for this one it's essentially a tell all did you listen to it? Cengiz, did you listen to it? Yeah, I checked it out also. So you guys have to fill me in. I think it was very interesting to listen to from the man, from David Fix. Because when you listen to a YouTube video, it feels like American people are in panic and the factory is burning down. But it feels like it's okay. And I have also been talking with Don about this behind the camera. And Don has played the upcoming game. man oh you almost said it you almost said it allegedly you said the c word you said i heard it my english is so bad cybernetic system you malfunction someone someone needs to replace your cpu cpu and put it in the tesla robot i don't know i heard a c i don't know what that means but i Heard something, ka-ka, something. Yeah, we can't deny or confirm, but he has played the new game. And Donnie says that he has played a lot of American Pinball games. And Donnie said something very interesting to me. He said, like, this game is a good game, but forget all of that. He said, this game compares to a Stern Pro. It's as good as a Stern Pro game. And Stern Pro games are awesome. And when Donnie tells me that it's this good, then I'm excited. Then I'm really excited. So, Donnie, can you give some small details here? I mean, it doesn't take much to excite me in pinball. I love new and flashy stuff, right? So, like, at risk of sounding like I'm Win Schilling for the company, you know, I try to share my real impressions, right? Galactic Tank Force doesn't do a whole lot for me. I like the fact that it's weird, but it's like I don't spend a lot of time playing at arcades, you know, once or twice here or there. barbecue when i happen by on location i play it again it's a really weird game a really strange decision i don't understand it i wouldn't call it good it's not legendarily terrible it's very very strange but this new game is just not just by american pinball standards but when i compared it to stern i was like saying like it feels like it belongs in the conversation as far as like that's how good this is, right? License theme, shoots well, has interesting things in it. Yeah, it's an actual game, not just, good for you, you made another Legends of Valhalla. It's legitimately a good title that I think people are really going to respond well to. And thank God, right? Thank God. But speaking about the company, if you come in with just the pinball perspective, and you're looking at American pinball as a company with a factory and employees and overhead and rent and stuff, and their only release in the last year was Barbecue, the sales for that game could not float that entire company. But then I look at what you've got behind you, that new Palicade, where did you get that from? Well, it shipped from American Pinball. They are shipping from American Pinball. They're loading 40-foot trailers like every day with these things and other projects that they're making too there that they don't talk about, partially because these are contract builds and they have their own NDAs. They can't talk about what else is going on there, Who else is coming into the factory like other big-name people outside of pinball but within electronic entertainment are showing a lot of interest in the little factory in Palatine, Illinois? So there's multi-facets to this thing. Now, they're all under Ametron. Ametron's not going anywhere. But that doesn't mean they would keep a company that was just losing money for them just for S's and G's, right? So I hear these rumors, and I live driving distance to this place. So if nothing else, I can go over there and drive by. Like, are there people going in and out of the factory? Is it a Wonka situation where nobody ever goes in, nobody ever comes out? But, like, I can see the loading dock. I can see the truck. I can see boxes going into trucks. I can go in there and talk to the guys. And so I tried to just give out, you know, one, the information I got from them I put out as here's what they said. And then what did I see? What was my experience? What was my gestalt? What did I feel when I was there? And that's what I put out as well. And luckily they had something new in the back room they didn't mind showing to me. And of course I'm going to go in there and play it. That's awesome. I'm kind of jealous right now. I know. It doesn't happen much, but dang it, right place, right time. I don't know. I didn't know any better, and I just went ahead and did it anyway. It's awesome. Ralph, you have to do podcasts with Donnie because every time Donnie sees this behind-the-camera stuff, he just goes on live with me, and I see everything also. well i uh i really want you know i mean i know i feel like all of us are very uh positive people in general which which i which is why i gravitate toward you guys for sure and i enjoy listening to you guys because um you know it's it's it's it's cool to be uh like like these these companies are making really cool products and i don't think anybody wants to see any of these companies not succeed uh but yeah the last couple of games just haven't really been they just haven't really resonated with a lot of people because the barbecue thing i really tried to like come up to that with an open mind but i'm like man like you know most of the themes in pinball i can relate to but barbecue like sure i like to barbecue but i'm not like oh man i really want a pinball machine that's themed on barbecuing and then when i saw the like video of someone cutting like into a roast i was like this is sort of weird dude i was like what is this Then I wanted to know whose house it was. Where did they film that? Was that someone at American Pinball that likes to barbecue? Or was it stock footage of someone cutting meat? I really want to know. The truth is it was probably stock footage, but it would have been so much funnier if it was all self-recorded. Oh, God. If it zoomed out and it was you, Don, cutting meat, then I'd be like, this is awesome. Just like extra ball and on the screen is me handing you a hot dog. I mean, we can ask the question in another way because all these companies, they talk with each other and they're like, the easiest way to sell a game is to invite Donnie. Just invite Donnie over and he buys a game. Dude, I'm not too far behind, Don. I think I get probably thrown in there too because when I saw John Wick, I was like, this is awesome. I love John Wick. The game's got a vibe. When Gary is talking with Jack, they're talking like that, right? So this is the question. Donnie, he visits Stern. He buys the game. He visits American. What did you visit at American? Yeah, that was the barbecue game. You didn't buy the barbecue. You didn't buy barbecue, did you? I didn't buy barbecue. He visited JJP. He bought the avatar. Now, this is the $1,000 question. Do you want to buy their upcoming game from American people? Ooh, that's a good question. Donnie, putting you on the spot. Are you going to buy it? God, I was like, I was walking in there like the last thing I need is like another game to put on my list right now. And then I was like, damn it. It's fun. I want to play it again. Am I going to end it? Will this be my first American Pinball purchase? Stay tuned for the Patreon for the real answer. No, I don't. Oh. No, no, no. I'm not going to do that to him. I'm trying to work some deals. You know, I've got some games that are on the short list for I've enjoyed them long enough. I need to give them new homes. And so if that happens and it coincides with tax refund season and we'll see what happens if I get drunk enough at TPF. But Don, you liked it. I did. I know you probably didn't spend a ton of time on it, but you enjoyed the time you did spend on it. Yeah, and after we – they showed me a couple other projects and things that are going on, not like another new title or anything. But then I came back and I'm like, I'm just going to jump on it a couple more times. Is that cool? Like, I really wanted to spend more time with it there. And then it helped, you know, having the designer there, too, to kind of go through the concepts and, like, what the future plans are for it. What I'll need to know, though, is what the price is. And they haven't landed on that just yet. But it's – I don't think it's going to be a $16,000 game. I don't think we're going to see that again. No signature editions. No, no. No, no. Yeah. They're very much like – There was a rumor – there was an American pinball game that has been rumored for a while. It's not the one I don't think you played, obviously. because if it was the game that you played, which I know it's not, but if it was, it would be hard for me not to want to buy it. When someone said that there was a rumor that they had the Masters of the Universe license, I was like, holy crap. All I envisioned in my head is me being in my game room being like, I have the power! I'd be like, dude, this would be awesome. There's so many epic moments. That would be such a good pinball theme. Sorry, Orko. You've got to sit this battle out. Oh, Prince Adam, do I have to go in there? He has the same kind of humor. Don and I, we're from 79. When are you from? 79. Oh, my God. Yeah, I'm born in 79. We're the best generation there is. Hell, yes. Best generation. So we enjoy Terminator 2 at the same time. Yeah, we do it with the coolest stuff. Yeah, baby. Bring me on a G.I. Joe pinball machine, and I'm buying that thing in one second. We probably all lost our virginity at 26. Yeah, huh? Right? You want a Thundercats? Give it to me. I want it. Oh, Panthro. I watched Inspector Gadget also. Could Inspector Gadget work as a pinball machine if JJP made it? If it was a split title with Danger Mouse, I'd probably get it. Inspector Gadget might be a little bit of a reach for me. But if it was cool, because I did love that cartoon as a kid. If they made it in a certain way, I think I could get behind it. If it was heavy and penny and brain, I would be there for sure. Oh, Rev, you visited JJP also, right? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So we're getting the collector's edition. Donnie is getting the collector's edition. Did you order a Just Avatar? Did you buy it? I didn't, man. I don't know. I struggle with that game. I'll tell you this every night, every Tuesday I have tournament night. And when, when they don't put avatar in the tournament, it's just because it's too long of a player. They don't put it in, but I always play it in between rounds and I do enjoy it, but I don't enjoy it enough to own it. I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't know. Like I actually have gotten less interested in it as I play it more. I was excited about it at first. Cause I was like, Oh, cause JJP just looks so beautiful. Like it's easy to get caught up in the beauty of how, pretty their games are. It's not one that I think... At first, I really liked the underplay fields, and then I was like, okay, now I really don't like them. They just don't... And the thing is, that's a huge element to it, kind of, and I just feel like it doesn't do it for me, unfortunately, but I want so bad for JJP to have some banger game that they come out with that everybody wants, because it's going to happen eventually. To me, if the Matrix is something they're doing, I am very, very, very interested in the Matrix. How about if it was Harry Potter? I literally don't care about Harry Potter. It's weird. I don't care. I did a whole thing in my podcast. I did this whole thing in my podcast. Because I'm from the East Coast, and sometimes my accent comes out. I feel like when I say Harry Potter, it sounds like I'm saying Harry Potter, like he's Harry. Harry and Harry sound so similar. Anyways. Not into Harry Potter. I'm not excited about Harry Potter. I mean, come on. You guys. Do something else. Matrix is awesome. I mean, do Matrix. That's awesome. But Harry Potter. Imagine having to, like, get out of the Matrix and you have to, like, lock the ball in, like, a phone booth or something. And, like, you know what I mean? Like, there's so many cool things already plugging into the Matrix. There's so many awesome things. Red and blue. Red and blue. So you've seen Green Light Show alone. Wow. You see games now where they grab the ball on the magnet, and then they time the pulses on the magnet to throw the ball in specific directions. So imagine the ball being thrown from one magnet to another real quick around the play field, or like a bullet time mechanism where targets rotate around it. Oh, dude, I didn't even think about that. Yeah. That could be really cool. That's what I want to see. Almost like how Ninja Eclipse does that firing between the scoops or something, like something similar to that, but with magnets. Yeah, like the ball is going straight down the middle and then just stops for a second, rotates, and fires off in a different direction. Oh, dude. And then it does like a bullet time thing Like a video on the back Oh dude that Donnie that's actually a good idea dude I mean if you're doing Matrix you have to Approach it like that Can you guys Are you behind Matrix like would you get excited about it No I would love I would love that but can you guys Imagine if Stern make a game with Keanu Reeves would you two guys buy it No no only a moron Would do that Especially in LA Oh, you'd have to be really, really stupid. I mean, really dumb. You know, a fun thought experiment would be to give the Matrix license to, like, the top three or four pinball companies and see what each one of them does with it because you know they would come out different, you know. JGP would be over the top with all the green and everything and, like, projections on the walls and stuff. And Stern would be, like, a very regimented, you know, fan layout, couple of ramps, nothing's going to break. And then Spooky would just go all into just madness and making it, like, a double wide game or something. and American Pinball would have rotating meat on the screen. It's like a rotisserie chicken thing in the back. What does this have to do with the Matrix? I have something I need to share with you guys because we're talking about American Pinball again. This is not S.H.I.E.L.D. This is not happy, happy, joy, joy, but I need to come up with this. Okay, just give me 30 seconds. Okay, so we are distros also for American Pinball. We want to sell their games. Also, we're rooting for all these companies. So we all know for a long time I going to say Cuphead has been the rumored game right Everybody in the world knows about it everybody has been talking about for like six months or something so we actually got reached out by a potential buyer that said that he was a huge fan of this theme and he was like no matter what i want to order this game cool short time after he heard a youtuber's show shitting on American Pinball like crazy. I understand, as a YouTuber, I understand the clickbait stuff and doing these kind of videos, but one YouTuber shit on this company, on American Pinball, and this buyer that was so interested in ordering an American Pinball game, he went back and he was like, I'm not going to buy an American Pinball game. I was like, why not, man? Why not? Take it easy. I was like, I watched that video on YouTube. American Pinball is shutting down. If I buy one of their products, I won't get parts. I won't get no warranty. And he jumped off. He's a huge fan of this theme. And he was like, no way I'm going to buy American pinball. So I just want to say here, please, Don has visited this company. David Fix is out and talking. They're fighting. They really want to make some games and enrich our beautiful world of pinball machines. Support these companies. I mean, take these kind of rumors with a grain of salt. I know I sound a bit negative right now, and if my English was better, I would have explained myself a bit better, but I hope you know what I mean. Yeah. Yeah, I spoke with Fix yesterday, actually. I was trying to work a trade deal for their new title. Still in the works with that. But I did commend him on going on to Loser Kid, And they asked him some pointed questions like, this guy hasn't been seen around anymore. What's going on here? Who's making these financial decisions? And Fix, to his credit, was answering them. And I said that that did a lot to reassure consumers, myself included, that it gives me a better picture of what's actually going on at the company. How is it structured? What pillars would have to fall for the company to fold? And I feel better after talking to him personally, so I wanted to share that. But that's part of what I said was like, you know, I need to know that if I purchase one of these games down the road when I need service, am I going to be able to get parts? And he did reassure me that the parts they're using are largely off the shelf. You know, the coils, mechs, flipper mechs, rubbers, posts, anything mechanically that would break is already commercially available from, you know, any supplies distributor. And then the boards are made in-house by Ametron, their parent company, which is absolutely going nowhere, except, I mean, they're going to be around, man. They're multinational. They've got factories all over the world. So even if the pinball company ceased to exist and you needed a board, they would still supply them is the sense. So I hope that can kind of flavor that a bit. Well, and correct me if I'm wrong, both of you guys. And I don't know if they do it under the Ametron name, but doesn't American Pinball provide their PCBs to other pinball manufacturers too or some flavor of them, or is that not true? It was true at a time, yeah. I think the Stern has now got suppliers, but I think they were supplying their Spike 1 boards. Okay. But not to your knowledge, they're not doing that anymore. Right. Not currently, no. Not anymore, no. No. No. So just don't panic. Don't panic, okay, about American Pinball. Rumors are just rumors. Just leave them. Buy their game. Support this company. Support all the companies, of course. If you like their titles, yeah. Well, and the thing is this, too, right? Like, these are private companies. It's not like they disclose their financials. financials. So for anybody to speculate on that, it's, I mean, we can obviously see like what games are selling and which ones aren't, but to speculate on the like financial, um, health of any of these companies, it would be impossible for us to do so because we don't work there. We're not in the CFO of the company. I mean, only they know really the truly the true nature of like, what does it look like is from a financial standpoint. So it, you know, I can go on, all of us could go online at any time and say anything we want about them, but we don't work there, you know? So. Yeah. It's dangerous to go that extreme. This YouTuber said that he had insider information, insider numbers. He began sharing sales numbers and stuff like that. It was hard for me to listen to. But still, I mean, we are all rooting for these companies. That's how I feel. I mean, think about these companies shutting down, not getting new games. It will be just like the arcade scene. We don't get new arcade machines, right? This with Red Bull, it's so cool. In a couple of weeks, we just got Metallica. We just got X-Men. In a couple of weeks, we will get another Stern game. It's so cool. Support these companies. And some media people are saying, you know, don't buy. Don't support. Buy on the secondary market. Buy when the prices are cheaper. But if nobody buys, there is no secondary market. I mean, that's just 2 plus 2. you know what I mean I don't buy any of these things though also like maybe this is where the lines get crossed like I don't buy this stuff as a oh this is an investment and I don't I don't have this idea in my head that they're it's going to go up in value it's nice if it does like it's great if it does but I don't you know I obviously don't want to sell it and lose a ton of money either but I don't buy these thinking like oh I'm buying this for the sole purpose of it's going to go up in value you know what I mean it's just it's nice to break even if you sell it and move it on and get another game you want. I mean, unfortunately, we're not really in that world as much anymore, so you will lose a little bit. But I don't know. Maybe I do this to just justify it to my own self. It's like if I do buy it and lose a little, I'm like, well, I rented it. You know what I mean? I don't know. Maybe that's stupid. If you were in the hobby like five, six years ago, then you would be used to I bought an Iron Maiden for $8,000 and I could sell it for $15,000 for the LE. so we were used to stuff like this and people were like no i don't want to play the game then the you know total plate counts would go up and i could then sell it for 14 instead of 15 ridiculous older i mean that'd be awesome if that was true today but i don't i don't know like that back then now you're buying john wick and it sells for like 10 now or something you know it's it's a different situation it's a different world pinball do you think though is is metallica proof that like if the game is popular enough though and i know they limited how many they made if the game is popular enough then you still could live in a world where you either break even or maybe even make a little bit of money because that game is that popular like if let's just say stern tomorrow releases a game that everyone flips out about like the community can't even they they're going bonkers for it i think that would still be true that as long as they didn't make too many of them you'd still have like a situation where you might be able to make a little bit of money because There's such a desire to have this game that everyone wants. There has to be one less than the demand. Metallica is a proven design. We know that game, okay, for 10 years. That's the first thing. Second thing, everybody loves the music. Third thing, the theme is from the 80s, 90s, right? We don't go back to Elton John times or Gone with the Wind and all that, you know, J.J.P. themes. This is 80s and 90s, which is great for our generation. Only 500 made, limited to 500. If they do it like this, then it will be success every time. If they, you know, give me some band from the 90s, you know, take Snoop Dogg-Dr. Dre-Two Packs. Oh, dude. Yes. 500 maximum, 500 LEs, put it up for 13,000. I guarantee you, first day sellout. And they could do a boring layout like, you know, orbit, left right, right ramp, and something bash in the middle. It will sell out day one. I'm coming for you once more time to demand your money for Snoopy Dog. What is it? What is it that we're making? It's got the low rider hydraulics on it. It's amazing. 420 limited editions. So, Seth stepped down. Bernie Sanders is now the CEO First of the company Oh man Don will still buy when they cost like $14,895 For a league It would be one a year It wouldn't be ten I still have to see the value that's in there I'm going to have a level of exuberance For any game It may be high, it may be low If my level of exuberance doesn't meet or eclipse the cost, then it's an easy no buy, right? Yeah. Because it could be an amazing game, but if it's $25,000, no. I don't think Alice in Wonderland is the worst game I've ever played. It was all right. It's just my level of desire for it did not meet that sales price. But that's just me personally. So I won't say no, but as you get in that higher level, it's hard to justify having that thing in your house that costs that much. If something happens to it, if it loses value, I'm going to feel it on that one a lot more than a well on a Deadpool Pro that I picked up for $5,500 with a topper, you know. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I want to round out this show by talking about Spooky Pinball, our latest Patreon supporters. Spooky Luke. Thank you, sir. So we know that, you know, Donnie, he's a really spooky shill. Ralph, the reason he was this late was because he drove his wife to the spooky place, and she's out shopping with the ladies from the Spooky. So he's really Win Schilling for Spooky, okay. But how is your thoughts about their newest game, Evil Dead? Did you buy it? How do you feel about it? Did you see the stream yesterday? Let's hear about your thoughts about Evil Dead. The funny thing about Spooky in general is my first time playing a Spooky game, and keep in mind, didn't have any clue that this was some kind of, like, not limited release but i played america's most haunted that was my first spooky game i ever played and i love actually i really liked it because it was just like so um i don't know like cheesy like it was cheesy but in a good way you know what i mean so i i really did enjoy that um so evil dead's interesting to me i did my pot i did a podcast on it where i was talking about how terrified i was of it as a kid because my cousin basically duct taped me to a chair made me watch and as a kid that was pretty shitty that's terrifying that was really shitty man I was like what did this really happen my cousin Bruce would never have done that but my cousin was my two cousins one of them was like a total jerk and the other one was like nerdy into computers so I always gravitated toward the nerdy cousin and he's the one that taught me all about electronics and stuff I will say this the theme integration in Evil Dead really is what hooked me going, okay, because, and this isn't because I don't like, wouldn't want to own it. It's just to me, because I'm maybe the past childhood drama, uh, I'm a little less interested in the theme, but Holy crap. When I, when I was watching some of the footage and content on it and how integrated it is to the theme, I was like, wow, if I was an evil dead fan, like this is almost a no brainer by like, it's a no brainer if you're a fan of the movie. and so i i really am rooting for spooky big time because i feel like they you can just see that the people behind their product like ooze passion about it like they're so passionate about what they're doing that i feel like any title they do they're gonna bring that kind of like excitement and passion on it so i think that game will be very successful for them uh mainly because there's that movie has a cult following now the problem is do you have enough people that are a cult cult following in love pinball probably i think because of the limited amount they're going to probably make so i think they'll do really well with it it's not one i'm gonna buy but it's mainly just because i'm not like the biggest horror movie fan in general like horror movie themed games are probably not going to be stuff i would i would ever really be interested in so i'm interested in that other side of spooky that makes those other like kind of oddball things you're like looney tunes and and scooby-doo and like gosh i love total new i know that was a scott denisi game, but TNA is really, really cool. Rick and Morty, I'd be into. I never bought it, but if I found one at a good price, I might be into that. So, yeah, I like spooky. I just, I'm more on the other side of what they make, not the horror theme stuff. So, because of your cousin, you're not buying the... Yes, it is. He is to blame for duct taping. I'm going to get a little child duct taped to a chair mod, and I'm going to put it in there, just for you. Oh, dude! Dude, if you do that, Oh my gosh, if you do that, please do that. I'd probably buy one if you did it. Honestly, I'd buy it just to put your mod in it. Oh shit. Ralph Mod. That topper, man. Put that topper next to him in his bed or something. That topper that goes up. Oh, and we can even talk about the topper. I mean, talk about... This is one of those things where I'm sorry, I hate to be a little bit... It's hard not to, but when you look at the Stern prices for a topper and then you look at what they did, it's like, okay. Dude. imagine a topper coming out for a thousand dollars it actually spans the top of the machine too you know metallica so by the way where the hell where the hell is the venom topper did they just decide not to sorry i know we're talking about spooky but are they ever gonna make that freaking topper like it's it's coming well they actually had a topper did you know that They had a topper. I heard the story. Like they said, didn't George say something like it was dangerous or someone got like hurt while they were making it? I'm like, what did it do? Did it shoot things out of the top of it? Like what the hell? It had to have a propane torch or something on there, you know, flame effect. Like it's actually shooting fire, which I'd actually be into if it did. Are you guys going to buy the topper for your Metallicas? No, no. Half-size topper? I'm not. I'm going to make a full-size one. yeah just spread it out there okay people i hope you enjoyed this show so if you like retro ralph sexy sexy boys and you want to check out his show where can people get your retro ralph so i have a i have a i have two channels one is retro ralph where i do long form content and then uh and then there's another channel called it was a legacy name but i i don't want to change it because people know it but it was called the retro ralph live and that's where my podcast is which is the Flipside podcast. It's also available on Spotify and Apple podcasts. So those two places. I've been putting a lot more time probably just because my time constraints into the podcast lately. I've been playing so much pinball and it's just been something I've enjoyed so much that the podcast is really what I'm most passionate about right now. I'm not abandoning Retro Ralph. You'll still see long form content but probably once or twice a month. I just can't do it as often as I used to be able to do. But, yeah, so I'd love it if anybody that's watching this, I think if you like these two positive guys, you'd probably like me too. So, yeah, if you check it out, I'd be grateful. Yeah, Ralph, let me tell you, people, I fully recommend YouTube. I don't really listen to so much podcasts, but Flipside, Retro Ralph, awesome podcast. But his YouTube videos, they are – I mean I'm 45. But if you know the younger generation that has got these thumbnails with fluorescent colors and everything, it's just when you see these thumbnails, you have to press and LED in the background. Everything is just shiny, shiny. The 20-year-old stuff that's just so popular, so good that I don't know how to do. Retro Ralph does this like a great student. These shows are so good, you have to take them out. I love them. He just made a show with the top 10 things that people should consider doing when they buy a new in-box game. I watched it two hours ago. What a great show. I recommend everybody to check it out. Thanks for joining. Thanks for getting whopped. Yeah, this was fun. This is so fun. I love what you guys are doing. And I, um, I, I, although I don't know, I have limited time. So I'm like, all right, I, is it, am I going to, am I going to do the WAP episode or am I going to do a Don's pinball podcast episode? So I have to like, I have to rotate, so I don't get to consume it all, but I really love what you guys do. And, and, uh, and I just love the positivity of it. I mean, of course you guys, when necessary are critical of things, but I feel like in general, it's a positive, you know, and, and, and that's to me like a hobby. It's a hobby. If your hobby is like something that makes you angry, then maybe you need to do something else. You know what I mean? That's the truth, man. Yeah, I mean, I only do this because it's fun, you know, right? When it stops being fun, I'm going to go do something else, you know? Yeah. Yeah, keep grinding the eggs. If you're angry or not even anger issues, nothing. If you have to borrow money to buy these games and stuff like that, do another hobby. Do something that's available and that makes you happy. I mean, when we make a super jackpot, we're alone, but we're smiling. It's a hobby. Yeah. We're looking around. I just did this. That's fun, man. Yeah, I love that. So, yeah, everybody just enjoy your hobby and have some fun. And we're always smiling. And, you know, Donnie, you cannot smile at anything else than just smile when you're together with this positive doctor. All right. All right. I'm pretty sure I watched Don, like, walking through Walmart in a Kentucky Fried Chicken outfit. I was like, I have no idea what he's doing right now, but I'm watching it. He looks happy. So many people, not even in pinball, are talking to me about that now. So that's just going to be my thing, man. Don and his Kentucky trips. Can I ask you real quick before we end it? Where do you get a Kentucky Fried Chicken outfit? That was from Wish.com. So wait, you went and found one. I had a couple of months where I got really into Wish.com because things are 89 cents, and I'm like, is this got to be a scam? So I just started ordering stuff, and I've got Skittles outfits. I've got so much stuff that came from there. Weird, strange things. You never know what you're going to get, if it's going to fit, if it's going to be actual human size, or if it's going to be perfect. And there's hits and misses, but you're not spending a lot of money. So, yeah. What's the other company? Not Wish, but there's another company. Teemu. Oh, Teemu, yeah. We just got from our government, we just got messages saying, stop ordering stuff from Teemu. Our government wants to shut that down, so we're not allowed to buy them. Is that because, like, I mean, just not to derail things, is it because, like, they don't feel like people are getting ripped off? Or what is the, like? I mean, there's so many. First of all, reason number one is there's some health-issue plastic stuff in toys and clothes and stuff like that. And, you know, further down, something with the economy, something with the import-export, something. You don't buy stuff from the Danish stores. should buy them from Timu for $1? That's so irresponsible of your government. Ours would wait for kids to grow third and fourth arms, and then they'd be like, hey, maybe we should stop supporting this company. Yours is like, yeah, there's a problem. We should probably stop. It would be like Timu donated a billion dollars to our campaign, so they're now getting a cabinet position is what would happen. Yeah, they're like, look, they use lead in toys, but it's fine. It's fine. Just drink your raw milk. It'll cancel it out. Yeah, we're not. I mean, they're selling, like, clothes, you know, and toys for kids. There's, like, no way. They're using recycled stuff, and they use rubber from cars, car tires, and make you baby, you know, biting toys. What are they called? When they're getting teeth, they get these toys they're biting in. Yeah. We make pizzas out of yoga mats here in the United States, so we don't even, like, Have you even been to Subway, sir? So, yeah, so we're not allowed to buy from them. And we are all – whole Europe is waiting for what your next president is going to do with that tariff stuff. We don't even know what's going to happen. If he puts 20 percent on top, then we're going to put 20 percent on top. And everybody wins. But, Donnie, Donnie, I know you have something against this like everybody else, but I talk with my – what's it called? Investment advisor. What's it called? Advisor. A guy that gives me advices. Tax advisor. Yeah, yeah. She actually said that I should buy some American stocks because if this tariff comes, then you Americans will keep all the money inside the U.S. You will buy and sell inside U.S. and your value will go higher up. So I just bought some U.S. stocks. And she says that in the next six months, it will go up. So, yeah, I would recommend that to everybody. Let's see how it goes. Jane gets the stock tips. Yeah. Just saying, just saying. So whoever's listening, you can't see it, but Don's been trying to put his finger on the outro music for, like, the last three minutes, and we keep talking, so. All right, guys. Well, Ralph, thank you so much for joining us. We're happy you're in the pinball community now. We welcome new voices, especially if there is velvety smoothies. and Sticker Brown, and we'll do more content in the future. All right. Bye, everybody. See you, everybody. Thanks, guys, for having me on. Oh, my God. WeArePinball69 at gmail.com is the email address to get to us, or patreon.com backslash WeArePinball. Join the fun. Be a producer. Come on. We need a number two. There can only be two. Ralph, go check him out on YouTube. Jenkins, go check him out at his financial planning office, apparently. All right. Later, everybody. And this podcast show was sponsored by Josh Cox. Go ahead and let him buy some games.