Journalist Tool

Kineticist

  • HDashboard
  • IItems
  • ↓Ingest
  • SSources
  • KBeats
  • BBriefs
  • RIntel
  • QSearch
  • AActivity
  • +Health
  • ?Guide

v0.1.0

← Back to items

The Pinball Show Episode 176 BONUS: Dennis' Top 5 Greatest Pinball Machines Of All Time From Each Company Part 2 (Chicago Gaming Company, Spooky Pinball, & American Pinball)

Pinball Show Patreon Feed·podcast_episode·43m 27s·analyzed·May 21, 2025
View original
Export .md

Analysis

claude-haiku-4-5-20251001 · $0.033

TL;DR

Dennis ranks greatest games from CGC, Spooky, and American Pinball; themes delays, build quality, and rule depth.

Summary

Dennis Creasel ranks his top 5 greatest pinball machines from Chicago Gaming Company, Spooky Pinball, and American Pinball. For CGC, he ranks Attack from Mars #1, followed by Medieval Madness, Pulp Fiction, Monster Bash, and Cactus Canyon. For Spooky, Evil Dead ranks #1 with Total Nuclear Annihilation at #2. For American Pinball, he discusses Oktoberfest (#5) and Galactic Tank Force (#4), highlighting production delays and design choices as recurring themes across manufacturers.

Key Claims

  • Chicago Gaming Company has experienced exacerbated delays, particularly with Cactus Canyon remake

    high confidence · Dennis states: 'Nothing I think has really shown the exacerbated delays of Chicago Gaming like Cactus Canyon, so it's been a frustrating process.'

  • Medieval Madness remake sold 1,000 units in a day during a recent re-release

    high confidence · Host confirms: 'A thousand sold in a day. Boom. Yeah. Like even big IPs with pinball companies struggle to do that.'

  • Attack from Mars had color issues with red playfield elements in early production runs

    high confidence · Dennis notes: 'they did have some color some of the reds had issues on the play fields early on uh in the first run uh that they did have to go back and and fix'

  • Spooky Pinball's Total Nuclear Annihilation introduced co-op play and the 'Denise lock' feature to pinball

    high confidence · Dennis explains: 'But it introduced co-op to a lot of people, and that was the number one way people wanted to play it' and 'the famed Denise lock' with sequential drop targets

  • Evil Dead is Spooky Pinball's strongest in-house layout design to date

    high confidence · Dennis states: 'I just think Evil Dead as a full package is just a better game for most people' and 'I think it's their strongest layout that they've done in-house.'

  • American Pinball Houdini was rushed and redesigned by Joe Balser to meet timeline constraints

    high confidence · Dennis explains: 'they had Balser come in and redo or entirely do a Houdini to meet a timeline they had set back when they were planning to do J-Pops Houdini'

  • American Pinball's Galactic Tank Force had poor production rollout with slow drip-feed release

    high confidence · Dennis criticizes: 'They slow drip fed this, and it made no sense why. And then you're at TPF with like eight or nine other new games'

  • Pulp Fiction is arguably the best single-level layout pinball machine of the modern era

Notable Quotes

  • “Nothing I think has really shown the exacerbated delays of Chicago Gaming like Cactus Canyon, so it's been a frustrating process.”

    Dennis Creasel@ 2:09 — Summarizes the core reputation problem for Chicago Gaming Company—production delays affecting game releases

  • “The theme to Chicago gaming is slow. That's their theme.”

    Dennis Creasel@ 6:24 — Capsulizes Dennis's primary criticism of Chicago Gaming across multiple games

  • “A thousand sold in a day. Boom. Yeah. Like even big IPs with pinball companies struggle to do that.”

    Host@ 10:24 — Demonstrates the exceptional market demand and brand power of Medieval Madness remake

  • “It embodies classic pinball, but with new modern technology. And it's a sight to see and to play.”

    Host@ 8:08 — Highlights Pulp Fiction's successful blending of retro aesthetic with contemporary mechanics

  • “This thing is their Wizard of Oz. Like, this thing is freaking jam-packed.”

    Dennis Creasel@ 25:04 — Emphasizes Evil Dead's feature density and quality as Spooky Pinball's flagship achievement

  • “This is the Teemu version of a 90s bally williams—this is some people some people enjoy the rules and stuff”

    Dennis Creasel@ 32:29 — Scathing criticism of Galactic Tank Force's design philosophy and execution

  • “You tried so hard, but everything about it was so half that you ended up the cake collapsed”

    Dennis Creasel@ 32:24 — Summarizes the perceived ambition-to-execution mismatch in Galactic Tank Force

  • “The layout is no longer in the way of the game.”

Entities

Dennis CreaselpersonChicago Gaming CompanycompanySpooky PinballcompanyAmerican PinballcompanyAttack from MarsgameMedieval MadnessgamePulp Fictiongame

Signals

  • ?

    product_strategy: CGC's remake strategy has proven highly successful; Medieval Madness reissue sold 1,000 units in a single day despite being a game remade multiple times across decades

    high · Host: 'A thousand sold in a day. Boom. Yeah. Like even big IPs with pinball companies struggle to do that.' Dennis: 'doesn't matter that this year is going to be so crowded with new original titles... You will sell them.'

  • ?

    product_concern: Chicago Gaming Company systematically experiences production delays across multiple titles; Cactus Canyon and Pulp Fiction both experienced substantial delays before release

    high · Dennis: 'Nothing I think has really shown the exacerbated delays of Chicago Gaming like Cactus Canyon' and 'The theme to Chicago gaming is slow. That's their theme.'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Spooky Pinball evolved layout design philosophy over time; early games had layout problems that hindered gameplay, but by Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Evil Dead, layout no longer impeded game experience

    high · Dennis: 'the layout is no longer in the way of the game' (Texas Chainsaw) vs. earlier criticism of Scooby Doo and Halloween layouts

  • ?

    product_concern: Build quality disparities across manufacturers and time periods; CGC early remakes had art/color issues (Attack from Mars reds), American Pinball experienced power supply problems with Oktoberfest

    high · Dennis on Attack: 'some of the reds had issues on the play fields early on... they had to go back and fix'. On Oktoberfest: 'minus I think power supply issues, minus that, they're built well.'

  • ?

Topics

Production delays and timeline managementprimaryGame remakes vs. original titlesprimaryLayout design philosophy and executionprimaryTheme integration and IP licensingprimaryBuild quality and manufacturing standardsprimaryRule depth and competitive playabilityprimaryTopper design and toy integrationsecondaryCollector and player preferencessecondary

Sentiment

mixed(0.55)— Dennis is generally positive about Attack from Mars, Medieval Madness, Pulp Fiction, Evil Dead, and Total Nuclear Annihilation, but highly critical of Cactus Canyon delays, Monster Bash layout, Galactic Tank Force execution, and Oktoberfest theming. His tone suggests respect for manufacturer efforts balanced against genuine design and production concerns.

Transcript

groq_whisper · $0.130

0:00
Warning, the following episode contains adult language and screaming goats. Listener discretion is advised. Thanks again for the ongoing support as a Pinball Show Club member. Enjoy this exclusive TPS content and make sure to visit the Pinball Show Club Discord to chat about the bonus material. Dennis, my friend, these people are really itching to hear what you think are the greatest games of all time in pinball from each of these companies. again part two part two so let's jump into chicago gaming company these are as a reminder to the
0:37
listener these are dennis's what dennis thinks are the greatest machines from or the greatest games from each of these companies now chicago gaming company keep in mind listener a little bit different they are known for making remakes of games so uh predominantly the bally williams So they've done Monster Bash and Medieval Madness. They've done Cactus Canyon, Attack from Mars. And then they even partnered up with Play Mechanics, typically an arcade company, to do the likes of an original game, Pulp Fiction, themed around the license Pulp Fiction, with Mark Ritchie as designer, et cetera.
1:13
So they do a number of things. But let's see what Dennis' fifth favorite game from Chicago Gaming Company is. well uh i went ahead and gave this one to cactus canyon remake poor cactus i knew you'd put it last did you did you really i knew vacation america wouldn't make it but uh yeah no i mean that was like so there's only one thing that couldn't make the list because there were six choices and i have five slots uh but yeah cactus canyon the the of all
1:50
the remakes, definitely the title that least needed it. I know they didn't make very many, but it's... And I've played the original quite a bit, actually. It's an okay game. It required them to pour a lot of effort into finishing the code and then releasing the enhanced code. Nothing I think has really shown the exacerbated delays of Chicago Gaming like Cactus Canyon, so it's been a frustrating process. But overall, it's still, I think, a relatively lackluster title.

medium confidence · Dennis asserts: 'it is arguably it is of the modern era the best sort of single level layout' with Bond 60th as the only exception

Dennis Creasel@ 20:01 — Marks a turning point where Spooky Pinball solved its chronic layout design problems

Cactus Canyon
game
Monster Bashgame
Evil Deadgame
Total Nuclear Annihilationgame
Texas Chainsaw Massacregame
Rick and Mortygame
America's Most Hauntedgame
Oktoberfestgame
Galactic Tank Forcegame
Houdinigame
Joe Balserperson
Mark Ritchieperson
Scott Deniseperson
Ben Heckperson
Texas Pinball Festivalevent
Play Mechanicscompany

design_innovation: Total Nuclear Annihilation innovated co-op play and sequential drop-target locking mechanisms that were novel to pinball at the time

high · Dennis: 'But it introduced co-op to a lot of people' and 'the famed Denise lock' with 'sequential in-line drop' that was 'visually really cool'

  • ~

    sentiment_shift: Dennis's reception of Spooky Pinball has warmed significantly over time; early games (America's Most Haunted, Total Nuclear Annihilation) seen as niche/janky but innovative; recent titles (Evil Dead) placed among best in industry

    high · Host notes Dennis had 'not the sharpest reception' historically but 'getting better.' Dennis places Evil Dead at #1 overall for Spooky and compares it to Wizard of Oz-level packed feature set

  • ?

    product_strategy: IP licensing with active property creators (Rick and Morty, Evil Dead) yields superior theme integration and player engagement vs. games without creative input from IP holders

    high · Dennis on Rick and Morty: 'If you've got someone involved with the property, who's like all in on this idea, you have so much that you can do.' Same noted for Evil Dead and Evil Dead films

  • $

    market_signal: American Pinball exhibits poor product launch strategy; Galactic Tank Force received 'slow drip feed' release at crowded show (Texas Pinball Festival) with competing new games, hindering market visibility and sales opportunity

    high · Dennis: 'They slow drip fed this, and it made no sense why. And then you're at TPF with like eight or nine other new games that people were trying for the first time.'

  • ?

    personnel_signal: Joe Balser brought in to rush-redesign American Pinball's Houdini after J-Pop Pinball's version proved geometrically unplayable; Balser's redesign was well-received, establishing template for future American Pinball output

    high · Dennis: 'they had Balser come in and redo or entirely do a Houdini to meet a timeline they had set back when they were planning to do J-Pops Houdini until they found out that J-Pop's Houdini was an unplayable diorama'

  • ?

    design_philosophy: Galactic Tank Force demonstrates risks of excessive feature additions without clear design vision; game packed with themes, mechanics, and props (folding tank, 3D printing, dubstep) that don't cohere

    high · Dennis: 'This is the Teemu version of a 90s bally williams' and 'You tried so hard, but everything about it was so half that you ended up the cake collapsed'

  • ?

    design_innovation: Pulp Fiction executed single-level playfield design effectively; Dennis ranks it as arguably the best single-level modern-era layout alongside Bond 60th Anniversary

    high · Dennis: 'it is arguably it is of the modern era the best sort of single level layout. You could debate against Bond 60th. That's the one exception where you've got Elwynn going up against what this was.'

  • ?

    product_launch: CGC's Medieval Madness remake strategy includes multiple production runs with strong demand; Merlin edition had 1,000-unit production run that sold in a single day

    medium · Host: 'doesn't matter that this year is going to be so crowded with new original titles. Go ahead and re-release Medieval Madness. You will sell them. A thousand sold in a day.'

    • 2:22
    But, I mean, the game itself, when it came out, it's a decent layout. So it had good bones to work with. I've heard positive things about the additional code aspects that they've done. I haven't experienced the extended code and those modifications, but other than it just being such a rare game, I don't think it brought any of the real magic, especially when it first came out, that we saw with their other remakes. It was a less known title, and it's a less liked title. And that's why it has to be number
    2:53
    five. There's arguments as to why. It wasn't just a lesser than game. Of course. Lots of arguments. But my logic is undeniable. Do you think that the upgrade kit has the ability to bump this up your list? Or no? It could. It could move it into fourth. But that's it. So go ahead and tell us, what is number four then of the greatest pinball monster bash remake oh okay i was i was thinking it could be
    3:27
    either monster bash or something else so okay monster bash so so why not number three for monster bash okay the issues are i don't think monster bash and this goes back to its williams actually shoots very good. I've never liked the layout. Pretty basic. Monster, yes, yes, but also everything feels, and I don't know how else to describe it, all the shots to me, every time I've played one, and I've played plenty of remakes, and I've played plenty of originals, they feel off.
    3:57
    It feels weird. The creature shot doesn't feel good to me. It feels weird. The center shot's good. I don't like how the pop bumpers operate. The game's got a good, The story is great. The toys are cool. Dracula coming out is awesome. I like how Frankenstein does the flips and stuff. It's a game I will play when I see it, but I've never loved the game. But I do think it's a better layout and a much more interesting story that it's telling than Cactus. And so it's for those reasons that it moves up.
    4:29
    Also, I think CGC's remake version of this looks really, really good. Beautiful. And so I think it was with Monster Bash that they kind of showed how they, I don't want to say came into their own because they were already, the very first remake with Medieval Madness was great. But at this point, like, I think they were firing on all cylinders in terms of lighting, the enhanced display, just all of it. And there weren't any real weird, other than how slow it was to come out, because that one was plagued by delays on top of what the usual slowness of Chicago.
    5:01
    but like Attack had issues with the art when it came out where some of the colors were off and stuff I didn't hear about that with Monster Bash it just seemed like everyone got them, they were built like tanks and it just we knew what all the features we were going to get with them and everyone was really impressed by it that's why I have it at 4 for me the code is what lacks in this game I know it's a lime and sheets and it's solid but it just doesn't feel like there's enough depth there I think he did it better later on, even with arguably not as deep a game either, but Iron Man, Tron, they feel
    5:39
    like the same type of code structure where it's like they're not deep, but they kind of are difficult, which makes up for the lack of depth in them. So it just never, it never pulled. I own one, but it never has pulled me in as much as the other Lyman Sheets coded games do. So that's number four. Okay, now I'm thinking I pretty much definitely know what number three is, but I don't know if people – I think people forget about this one.
    6:14
    Well, my number three is Pulp Fiction. Yeah, why would they forget? Probably because it took forever for them to come out. You notice the theme here? There's a theme. There's a theme to everything. The theme to Chicago gaming is slow. That's their theme. But Pulp Fiction, arguably, I don't even think it's much of an argument. But there's one. What I was going to say is arguably it is of the modern era the best sort of single level layout. You could debate against Bond 60th.
    6:44
    That's the one exception where you've got Elwynn going up against what this was. But and whether or not you want to quite call this exactly a single level, because I think there is a little rampy style shot to it. This feels very classic. Yeah, it's a classic. Yes, it's a very classically inspired, well-executed use of the theme. However, pretty hard game. So very challenging, unlike basically everything else Chicago makes, because everything else Chicago makes are remakes of very fan layout style games. So I just thought that the way they took the theme, used the retro style to it, and put it all together.
    7:20
    I don't have a ton of time on this game, but I really appreciate the originality behind it. And I thought it was a really good original effort, especially when you think that the only other original effort they had was Vacation America, and that game is terrible. Have you played Vacation America? I have. It is truly terrible. It's bad. It's really bad. But every example I've played is really bad as well. Oh. Now, I could make all the shots. If y'all are at a show and you see Vacation America, do try it so that you understand. I don't know what they were thinking.
    7:50
    Suffering is worth it. But, yeah, I'm with you. Pulp Fiction is like they went so far into like a classic feel. They reproduced a coin door that was that stainless steel. It really, really looks like it came from the past in the best way possible. It's a filthy game with that theme, but it embodies classic pinball, but with new modern technology. And it's a sight to see and to play.
    8:20
    I do love that game. So the battle between one and two here. I know which way you went, but the listener may not. So list off. Well, they should. List off number two. Your second greatest, in your opinion, pinball machine from Chicago Gaming Company is. Medieval Madness remake. Merlin's magic. Yes. The one that put them on the map and got them a ton of respect.
    8:52
    A lot of this is just driven by the fact that I don't think it's the best playing remake that they've done. And that was true in the Bally Williams era as well. However, it was the right answer to be the one to start with because the castle toy is iconic. It is fun. The layout is easy to do. It's easy to understand. The rules are simple. It's funny. It's got good call outs. there are a few other things though that because this was the first one, this is where
    9:24
    you had the classic edition and they were still like here you'll get the basic DMD display and stuff and they learned over time like no, that's not the stuff people want. They want it enhanced. This is where I think some companies have taken it too far like saying, alright, let's totally change the artwork of Funhaus. That's not what people want. What they want is a big old display. Speaker lighting and Yeah, and color-changing RGB and all that. So Medieval didn't have all of that initially when it came out, so that also kind of pulls it down for me.
    9:58
    It's just Chicago was learning from that one, and then they realized as they were going along what was selling, and then they pivoted. And by game number two, they pretty much had the formula down. But medieval was the right one to start with, and there's a reason why it was like, absolutely, it doesn't matter that this year is going to be so crowded with new original titles. Go ahead and re-release Medieval Madness. You will sell them. A thousand sold in a day. Boom. Yeah. Like even big IPs with pinball companies struggle to do that.
    10:30
    This is an original theme. After how many years and how many times have they remade the Medieval Madness? Another run, another run, another boom, another thousand sold. No questions asked. That shows a lot right there. Do you think the same could be said for your number one pick? Yes which obviously is Attack from Mars remake I think it plays better I think that Chicago had learned from what was working in terms of sales
    11:00
    and what people wanted on medieval and really went into Attack from a better perspective. Also, even though I'm not a topper person, Attack's my favorite topper that they've done, so they get brownie points for that, which helps keep it elevated. so yeah it was yeah they did have some color some of the reds had issues on the play fields early on uh in the first run uh that they did have to go back and and fix for people but but gameplay wise it i've always thought i mean it's basically the same way out as medieval it's weaker on the toy
    11:30
    front overall however i think the rule set is better there's there's more ways to approach it Again, these are 90s games. There's usually just one way to approach it. And you can argue that Attack has two good ways and a third possible way from a playing perspective that have potential. So it's just got a little bit more balance to it in terms of what its rule set is. And since this wasn't like a cactus where they were getting an extended code release, I just think, yes, yet. But that's what I'm judging off of is what we have in front of us.
    12:03
    So overall, though, I think it was always a better game than Medieval Madness, other than the bill of materials isn't quite as good. But Chicago did other things. Well, and Chicago's bill of materials had other stuff going for it. So I still remember the first Texas Pinball Festival where they had those toppers and the arms were waving and all that. And I was just like, wow, that was really impressive. And toppers generally do not impress me at all. You could not care less. Yeah. So Chicago Gaming Company, the rundown. Number five, Cactus Canyon.
    12:33
    Number four, Monster Bash. Number three, Pulp Fiction. Number two, Medieval Madness. And number one, not only the greatest pinball machine from Chicago Gaming Company, but one of Dennis Creasel's favorite games, period, Attack from Mars. Let's jump into Spooky Pinball. Now, they've created quite a catalog where you do have many more than five to pick from. Yeah, I had a lot. I had a lot to pick from. But we do know historically you have an appreciation that may be arguably warming at this point.
    13:09
    But, you know, for years, probably not the sharpest reception you've had to this company's offerings. Getting better, but still not there, I would argue for you. Pretty close, right? Yeah, I mean, overall, that's an accurate statement. It depends what we're talking about. Like, Spooky's had a pretty good art game for a very long time, but they had some very weird layout choices. Very weird. I would guess, tell me if I'm wrong, that you still think that it would be difficult to really name five great games from Spooky Pinball.
    13:45
    You're filling in this list, but for you, I could see you saying only one to three would be considered really good to great pinball machines. I'm going to say of my five, I think four of them, a lot of people would probably actually argue are really good games. So we're getting the fifth. No, I mean, I don't think I struggled more with at that point. I don't think I see dominoes on this list. I don't think we see Jetsons on this list.
    14:17
    I've actually not played dominoes. I've never found one to play. There was one at one show once, but it had a line. But I have played Jetsons. And no, it's not on my list. Spoiler. A number of, I don't think, Rob Zombies is going to make it on this list, but we'll see. What comes in at number five of the greatest spooky pinball machine of all time, per Dennis Creasel? The one that started it all, Zach, America's Most Haunted. Oh, now I got a soft spot in my heart for that. What do you like about it? Yeah, it's just, again, it's the idea behind it more than anything.
    14:48
    It actually plays all right. It does. Yeah, you see the 3D printed parts and stuff. It's the most janky looking. It's the jankiest looking thing you ever did see that could claim itself to be a production game. The voice audio levels are terrible, so it's hard to hear. But it's actually funny what they decide to do with it and go with the sort of funny ghost story. Almost like a Scooby-Doo in a way. Ghost hunters. Approach to, yeah, just like for ghost hunting and stuff. The rule structure is pretty good. Yeah. It's basic, but it's pretty good.
    15:19
    Modes, 90s feel. One of their worst art packages. Oh, God, yeah. But just, yeah, overall, I actually think it's kind of a fun game. And so, yeah, I felt, yeah, I'll let it barely get on the list. If I could trust it holding up better, I would own more. Yeah, that's true for a lot of their stuff back in the early days. It's true. It's very true. So America's Most Haunted. Nice pick there. What about number four? This is one that you probably had. I don't remember anymore where you ranked.
    15:49
    probably had higher, but I'm going to put Rick and Morty at number four. Well, it made the list, though. Okay. It did. Hey, I'm trying to. It's not Dennis' favorites. These are the top five. If you think they're the greatest, yeah. I don't like how Rick and Morty shoots. I don't know what many people do. I feel some of the geometry needed. I felt it needed a couple more Whitewoods, quite bluntly. However, the theme immersion in it is off the chart.
    16:19
    And again, shows the show. We saw this with Guns and Roses and JJP. If you've got someone involved with the property, who's like all in on this idea, you have so much that you can do. And so you have, you have that humor and humor is one of those things where just, and Americans most often have that humor too, but where we just don't have a lot of pinball where people feel like it's really funny. Like the only game I know of that from Stern that anyone will say has any sense of humor whatsoever in, in a high quantity is Deadpool,
    16:49
    followed by Elvira's House of Horrors, if you're into the double entendre sort of stuff. So Spooky's tried to do this more often, but Rick and Morty is their piece de la resistance. Oh, perfectly. I probably said that all wrong in French. However, in terms of all-in, raunchy humor, customizable, so you can control how raunchy it would be. They gave it to you. The animations look good on the screen. I thought the rules were fine
    17:19
    I thought the rules were fine it's just the layout that keeps it so low on this list and maybe build materials and still production stuff yeah a lot of what you're describing is the code and the rules what animations it's funny because they knew how to organize it to be funny you can't just throw stuff in there Simpsons Pinball Party is pretty funny too but this is just a hilarious pinball machine if you like that theming.
    17:52
    So I'm with you. That's like the big reason I love the theme. I love the call-outs. Artwork is really nice, and I love its difficulty, but the rules are really, really great, and I like that group that did the rules, and I was really happy to hear that the majority of that group, if not in the entirety, went over to Barrels of Fun because we get more games like that. Labyrinth was very similar. That's a good pick. I do love Mesa, Rick, and Morty. Top three, though.
    18:22
    There's only three spots. The top three. What's the number three spooky pinball machine for you? I felt it's Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Their favorite. Wow. I know it's the spooky crew, the Bug and Charlie. That's their favorite, right? It flows good. It does. It plays good. I like the rule set. I think the rule set's better on it than Looney Tunes. A lot of people think so. Clearly, the game was designed with Texas in mind first when you look at the toy swaps between the two. Meat grinder.
    18:52
    Great theme immersion. Not the best theme to go with. Even in the horror pantheon, I'm telling you, Texas Chainsaw Massacre would not have been in my top five horror movies to first pay tribute to. Or top ten. But nonetheless, it is iconic. People do know it very well. And I thought they incorporated it fairly well. I'm not a huge fan of some of the visual display choices in terms of like what they're trying. The movie is so low rent that it almost cheapens the game when you see some of the stuff on the screen.
    19:26
    And quite frankly, it was telling because this in no way was Spooky's fault. But this came out when we also saw Barry O's barbecue come out, and the meats dripping on the Barry O's were creepier than the Texas Chainsaw clips. But overall, really good. Much better build quality at this point also helps have this game up higher. So anyway. Yeah, toys were cool. It flows better than we've seen at that point. This layout is going to be a lot more familiar.
    19:59
    Still tough, though. Still tough shooter. This is not one of their easy games. However, the fact that the layout didn't try and get cute for cute sake, like they peaked on that with the Halloween Ultraman stuff. And then they started to try and, like, make things a little more. So this was this with Looney Tunes was the first where I thought the layout is no longer in the way of the game. Even Scooby Doo had a problem with the layout was still getting in the way of the game. And Texas, I was like, you've moved past that.
    20:29
    That's your biggest problem at this point. One of the toys in this game is a woman jumping out of a freezer. That's awesome. What's the number two spooky pinball machine? For number two, I went ahead and put the Scott Denise Total Nuclear Annihilation. Oh, wow. Now, this was in the still build quality janky era. However, this game is so mechanically simple, people encountered a lot fewer build quality issues with them.
    21:05
    There was just less that could go wrong with them. There was still plenty. There was still hot glue, mozzarella, string cheese going on under the play field on them and all that. Actually, this is the only one on my list that I owned. Yeah, you did. However, the layout is stellar. It's my favorite layout Spooky ever did. Yeah. Scott had worked on that one for quite a while. the sound. In my game room, I had to put the volume on one. I had it on one. Any lower, it was muted,
    21:36
    and it was still more powerful than anything else in my lineup It changed sound and pinball Yes Obviously nothing really going on with the LCD display That was really just incorporated because that how the menu system was But you had the numeric displays. The lighting was incredible. It changed lighting, too. What holds the game back is the rules are really simplistic, and there's not much to do on the game. It's basically get into multi-ball and try and do your reactors. And that's really the only right way to play it.
    22:07
    It brought co-op, too, kind of? Yeah, but it introduced co-op to a lot of people, and that was the number one way people wanted to play that game while I owned it, was let's play it in co-op mode. So that was fun. We got to have one pop bumper down low. We saw a whole rash of them start to come up. And, of course, the famed Denise lock. Yes, we've seen balls locked behind a drop target, at least as of Stern Star Trek with Steve Ritchie, I'd seen that. But here we had a sequential in-line drop, so we're doing a lock feature, which was just visually really cool.
    22:38
    It was a game that won people over at shows and it put Spooky on the map for a lot of people who otherwise was just like, oh, that's cute. Some people in Wisconsin are playing at pinball. Yeah, they chose to support the community by taking a hobbyist and saying, let's mass manufacture this. And for a while it was their number one produced game. For sure. And its first run was 550 units. They could probably do another run in a couple years and sell another couple hundred units too, I would bet. Possibly. They did do a second run later on, and they did sell them all, but it took quite a while.
    23:12
    Or if Scott ever thought about doing a reimagining, increasing the – Yeah, like a 2.0 would be interesting. Yeah, and maybe throwing a ramp in there or something. Some people feel that's what he did with Multimorphic, that that's what the – Or Rick and Morty. Final Resistance is, is the spiritual successor to Totally Clear Annihilation. Yeah, I could see that. TNA, oh, favorited amongst many. But maybe surprising to a lot of people seeing it as number two rather than number one.
    23:44
    So number one, the greatest spooky pinball machine of all time for you would be? Oh, Evil Dead. It is really solid. Yeah. Layout's good. Especially for a wide body. Yeah. Theme integration, I mean, but it's still, it's the best game. They've got the build quality down. I've been hearing very good things about the build quality. I saw how they held up at TPF. Theme integration is right there with Rick and Morty, but the layout is so much better.
    24:15
    Rules look good from what little I've been able to experience with it. Toy integration is there as well. It's beautiful. It just feels like it's got a good bill of materials going on. There's stuff to do in it. So there's just more to play and enjoy on it than in TNA. and with the theme immersion and everything else, taking a license. Again, a very cult classic set of movies because it does the first two Evil Deads. Properly incorporates both of them. I mean, the only other time I think of where we've seen that is with Alien and Aliens and the Alien pinball.
    24:48
    But it plays way better than Aliens. It's like their Twilight Zone, but better shooting. Yeah, and probably, we'll have to see long term, but probably also better build quality than Twilight Zone. Yeah, maybe. Twilight Zone has a lot of things that break. Maybe better rules. But this thing is their Wizard of Oz. Like, this thing is freaking jam-packed. And for a wide body, it still feels good. Yes, it did. Like, I didn't notice the wide body nature of it. Whereas, like, I know it wasn't Scooby a wide body as well.
    25:20
    That felt like a wide body, yes. Yeah, it's just the way they, like, they did it to accommodate the upper play field and stuff in the back. but they just kind of left, I suppose, to not make it feel floaty. They just kind of not did anything down lower. That's always the struggles. What do you do the closer to the flippers you get on a wide? With Evil Dead, with the shotgun stuff and all of that, they were able to use that space in a way where you didn't really have to feel like it. It felt like they didn't know how to make stuff work down below.
    25:50
    So overall, I think it's their strongest layout that they've done in-house. You could possibly argue that Total Nuclear Annihilation is a better overall layout, but no. I just think Evil Dead as a full package is just a better game for most people. I would love to see – we'd never be able to see it, but it would be very interesting to see what the bill of materials on Evil Dead is compared to other pinball machines released in the last five years.
    26:21
    It just seems like they put a lot into that game. lower play fields, the medieval madness pop-up stuff, a roving hand, that thing. Even like on the apron, like spinning little reels, a cabin. Damn, that thing is freaking loaded. Spooky pinball. So that kind of surprised me a little bit in a good way, in a pleasant way. Yeah. I like that list. That's a good list.
    26:51
    Will there be a list quite like that when we move to American pinball? No. So there's more than five games in America? How many games are there? It's close. I think there's more than five. There are. There's more than five. But which ones we'll find on this list is a mystery to us. Let's start at number five. And this could be, we may not have to go back to this list in ten years. There might not be any additions. We'll have to wait and see. Without the power of Fix and his team to keep things going.
    27:24
    What's the number five? American Pinlocking. Oktoberfest. Look at the little V in there. He just wants to go down the slide. Oktoberfest. What an idea. Joe Balser's masterpiece. This game is not great. For a variety of reasons. But I could not allow barbecue to be on this list. because I think there are six titles
    27:57
    that American Pinball. So, here you go. Here's number five. So, okay. Here's, all right. Why can't it be on the list? It had some interesting ramp design. Sure. And it did fully embrace the theme. Yeah. So, it had, you know, it had an okay-ish sense of humor. I love toys. It had stuff. Physical ball locks. But, what a terrible theme. you couldn't tell if you had balls locked in the barrel which I think they tried to argue
    28:28
    was like a high point or a highlight or a feature and it's like no, no one likes that stuff it just, you know, we have to remember this came out after their first game Houdini which was known to have been rushed because they had Balser come in and redo or entirely do a Houdini to meet a timeline they had set back when they were planning to do J-Pops Houdini until they found out that J-Pop's Houdini was an unplayable diorama that geometrically would not work. And that game was good.
    28:59
    And then you have your second sophomore effort as Oktoberfest, setting aside the whole scandal with the monkey and everything that happened initially in the artwork and all of that. The art wasn't great in any iteration. The voices were humorous, I suppose, in a 90s valley, maybe late 80s. Williams way, but it just nothing about it I really liked, and compared to what they had done before, it was a huge step back. The only thing that stood out was it still felt like they had a decent bill of materials in the game,
    29:31
    and while these were being built, they were still overall seen as a pretty robust brand in terms of holding up. And initially, when they were building Houdini and then into Oktoberfest, they became quickly known as a company that could manufacture at a good pace and that built quality products. That fell off later throughout the years, but initially like Oktoberfest, minus I think power supply issues, minus that, they're built well. But yeah, okay, so that's number five. What falls into the number four
    30:01
    spot then? For me, number four is Galactic Tank Force. It made the list. It did. Barbecue cannot make the list. I thought these are the rules. So, all right, Galactic Tank Force. Highlights in terms of notable things. It has a very campy sense of humor that it leans totally into.
    30:32
    The tank model that folds up into a tank. What a weird, creative idea, but clever. Those are the highlights. Oh, man, that's it? It's just a short list, huh? I mean, the rules might be okay. I'm not sure. The layout, it's not a single ramp layout in the modern era. Modern era was a weird choice. But so much about, I mean, the problem is I, like so many people, played this game.
    31:06
    It was a very crowded year for pinball. A very crowded month for pinball. This had a terrible rollout by American. They slow drip fed this, and it made no sense why. And then you're at TPF with like eight or nine other new games that people were trying for the first time. The drop target banks were airballing back over the flippers. You have this campy sci-fi theme, and you're running dubstep music. It was like – it felt like a fever dream or a whole bunch of – I heard Atari back in the Bushnell era.
    31:40
    like they would get stoned and get in the hot tub and like come up with ideas for games and stuff this felt like that like this was a fever dream or some a group of stoners got together and just started whiteboarding things and then no one ever took the red marker and drew lines through any of it and so you end up with let's do 50 themes let's do corny b b tier actors who are clearly reading their cards off off camera angle we don't have a proper uh teleprompter set up let's drop in dubstep. Now let's spend a gazillion
    32:11
    billion BOM dollars to have it fold up into a tank for some people. 3D print the tank on the plate. It was so ambitious, but so wrong. It was like, you tried so hard, but everything about it was so half that you ended up the cake collapsed This is the Teemu version of a 90s bally williams like this is some people some people enjoy the rules and stuff so that why i love this game to be on the list and i do think actually artistically i think it looks good it's but phenomenal but the
    32:46
    gameplay isn't there for me the layout isn't there for me the mix of the music and the tone is not like none of it works it's like if they took a 90s bally williams that we love and they dipped it into a Gottlieb Premier VAT and then pulled it back out, that's GTF. It's like, oh no, what did you do to it? The difference is I would argue that in Gottlieb Premier, your layout would have been better and your rules would have been worse than what we have in GTF. But, I don't know.
    33:18
    Yeah, I just... Oh, so much potential. So much potential. This is close to... They're going all in on this original themed thing. This is close to a successful original theming that everybody always – this is like the reason that I don't think original themes will work because this checks the boxes of like the beauty of an original theme, the storyline. It's quirky. It's 90s. It's fun. It just – it didn't work for a lot of reasons.
    33:50
    But to me, this is about as close as we're going to get, and it just – nobody bought it. Like even like not financially, but nobody bought the premise. Nobody bought the idea. They just couldn't get it. If they had with a different campaign, you know, tweaks. So the, you know, obviously in place of the game isn't rejecting and stuff. Had they done a campaign like spooky with TNA having something maybe before it even has art Whitewood style, you know, home growing excitement for the concept. If people had felt invested in the idea of it, but it just it didn't make any sense.
    34:23
    You're just like, yeah, we're going around and we're going to – it's going to be like a 50s theme. Okay, cool. I'm like, I'm with you. You're going to be a tank in space. I'm like, okay, that's a little weirder. Not just spaceships, but all right. I'm kind of there. Oh, and we're going to have dubstep. And ice cream. You're saving the – And then you're fighting for ice cream. And I'm like, I get that it's a joke, but it's an inside joke at this point. This is like if you themed a pinball game around how Williams put cows in everything. It's like we're going to have a cows game. No, they knew not to do that because it's dumb.
    34:54
    The writing was horrible. Yes, no. Which, again, could play into the corniness factor, but they didn't put their foot all the way in the pond on anything. And so it tried to be everything, and every choice was wrong. Yeah. But it's number four because I like it better than Oktoberfest. Some of the cut sequences were almost like the intro of a porn. It didn't go there, but it's like – I know I'm ragging on it, but that's just because they clearly put a lot into it. I had like zero expectations with Oktoberfest.
    35:27
    Galactic Tank Force actually disappointed me. But overall, as a combined package, even with its disparate pieces, I do think it's a better game than Oktoberfest. I hope time heals the wounds of GTF. Some people like it. Some people really do respect it and would probably put it at number one. Did you put it at number one? I'd have to go back and look. I don't know. I'd probably put Houdini as number one, but who knows? Number three on your list. Legends of Valhalla.
    35:59
    Ugh. Yeah, I figured you probably would. That's just not one I like. I put it in the middle because it's a middling game. Yeah, that's a good point. The art isn't impressive. Some people got offended because there was like a dead person on the side of it, But overall, the art itself was fairly uninspired, which is par for the course for most of American Pinball's art packages. There was a lot to the layout, though. I played it a few times. I thought the rules that Steve Bowden was developing here, I thought these rules were stronger than Galactic's rules.
    36:32
    And that's really why I've moved it up. And the layout felt like a more acceptable layout in the modern era, as in there's not one ramp. It had some interesting stuff going. Yeah. But the theme, I constantly got this confused with Wrath of Olympus and whatever. But again, a lot of the layout was done by an outside group, and maybe that's why it sort of has a different feel to everything else. I would never really argue American Pinball fell into the trap of all their games feeling the same. I think they all feel pretty different.
    37:04
    For better or worse. Yeah, for better or worse. But yeah, it's pretty forgettable. I just, because it doesn't, it didn't wrong me like GTF did, and I don't despise it like Oktoberfest, and obviously barbecue can't be on the list, I put it at number three. Okay. We're running out of spots here. Okay. What about number two? That's where I have Houdini. There it is. Ladies and gentlemen. Yes. Pretty good game. Shots are tight, but findable.
    37:35
    Too tight, quite frankly. However. It's a tough shooter. Considering it has been, to date, probably the best theme they have, I would say. All right. So it's not licensed, but it's not an original theme. People know Houdini. He's very famous. The catapult shot alone had to put it into the top two. One of the coolest toys ever, yeah. Especially when you consider it came out, and then Stern put out Aerosmith,
    38:06
    and it had a much lamer catapult shot to fire into the toy chest. So you had that. There was a lot to do in it. It was colorful. Magnets everywhere. There was a lot of toys and stuff. Yeah, there was a lot of stuff going on with it. And Bolzer, especially considering the timeline he had for it, I thought this turned out pretty well. I don't even know if they did a whitewood. Yeah, I don't know. Honestly, they should have pulled out one shot. It was too hard for most people and not hard in a good way.
    38:37
    Well, it doesn't drain as much, so you get a lot of just missed shots, which makes it feel clunky. Yes, it's a brick fest. I remember they developed those extra thin stand-ups because the shots were too tight. Pretty smart, though. They needed smaller than normal stand-ups so that when you'd brick, you'd hit and get stuff. I'm surprised nobody used those in the future. It's pretty clever. Most people know better than to put that many shots in the game. Well, if not, it's a post. But anyway, so, you know, decent theme, decent layout. Steampunk is a beautiful looking.
    39:07
    Great toys. Yeah. No, it looks good. I would say it is their second best looking game. I'll give the edge to Galactic Tank Force. I think Galactic Tank Force is their best looking game. But Houdini is a number two, a solid number two there. So number one, a lot of pinball, pinball playing people would agree with you at number one. Yeah. Hot Wheels is all that's left to my knowledge. So it's Hot Wheels at number one. Their one attempt at a licensed theme. So I'm giving it some credit there. All right. Was it the right licensed theme?
    39:39
    No, Zach. We know it wasn't the right licensed theme. Worst theming ever. Well, I mean, it depends. We're only counting licensed themes or not, I suppose. But I got the idea. But again, this was like where you could tell it was like baby's first business job. Because it's like, hey, I'm getting told that I need a license. So I need to find a license I can afford. And so you go with something and you say, oh, wait, Hot Wheels. Everyone knows Hot Wheels. And the answer is yes, they do. The problem is Hot Wheels doesn't come with any sort of story tied to it. So there's nothing to latch on to about wanting to experience the world of Hot Wheels.
    40:13
    No emotional. Apparently there was a YouTube show and maybe the YouTube show is good. And that's what they use for the displays. But nobody who bought the thing knew the YouTube show. So that was that point was kind of where it stands up. It is their best layout. Yeah, arguably. And it is their best layout and arguably their best rule set. Also, it was the only one of their games that attempted to consider the arcade market. And I think American Pinball needed something more affordable than what they were doing, given that they were basically a no-name brand.
    40:47
    So that was the right angle. Yes, you have to hit the RPM targets too much. Yes, this one was more susceptible to breakage than Houdini and Oktoberfest were, to my knowledge at least. We had one of these on route, and it was constantly uncooperative. However, theme integration was still solid, even though it wasn't the right theme to go with. The animation stuff being straight from the YouTube show, you couldn't criticize all that much unless – I mean, you could just hate the style, but it was what it was. But for a racing game, I thought the setup there, it worked pretty well. The rules could have been better balanced, but that was true for all of their titles.
    41:20
    It had plenty to do with it. I put it at number one just because I think it was the right route they needed to go. and it actually is a pretty good playing game and it was a pretty good price. But yeah, no. Compared to our number one with Chicago and our number one with Spooky, this would not make the list. Maybe it'd make number five on the Spooky. It might knock America's Most Haunted out. Not for me. It just never clicked with me. Never clicked. A lot of people it didn't. I think a lot of people would agree that's probably their best game
    41:52
    though. I don't know. I think Houdini would win a lot of people as their number one. There's a list of misfits there. Yeah. Where do you think Cuphead will fall? People are saying it's their best game, but I don't know what that says. I don't think it ever comes out. I don't. I don't think we'll ever see it. Do you think it will be more rare than GTF? Yes, I do. I think it might be, too. Because if they contractually just have to get something out. From what few people I've heard talk about it that said that they've had some time with a version of it, I do think it would make the top five.
    42:27
    I do, too. It doesn't take a lot to kill Oktoberfest off this list. I don't know why I'm thinking of that. What was that Offspring song? It starts, gluten, gleeden, glotten, glow, every time I hear Oktoberfest. I don't know why. Pretty fly for a white guy. So to recap American Pinball Top 5 greatest from Dennis Creasley believes number 5 is Oktoberfest Number 4 GTF Number 3 Legends of Valhalla Number 2 Houdini Number 1 Hot Wheels I like it Where will the future take us Dennis
    42:59
    Probably into Bally Williams, Sega, Dad East and Gottlieb Premiere because I already got them written up And as a Coming soon I did not give my top 5 on street down the middle video on Gottlieb premiere, but I will be providing my top five Gottlieb premiere as well. So maybe number three amazes us. I will. Number two might. Oh, intriguing.