But to me, though, the mech, the underrated mech, in my opinion, is actually the dungeon scoop popping out of the playfield. And the reason I say that, I've really grown to enjoy it. And the reason I say that is because it's not a gimme. It can be a challenging shot. And the way they implement that shot, there are certain modes, like the Tiniest Dice utilizes it. But when you're doing a dungeon, a town dungeon, once you complete all the modes in a town, you have a chance to do the dungeon, which is kind of a little mini wizard mode. Those dungeons have levels. So to get down to the next level, the scoop pops up. And it's a tough shot. So it's like a reward where it's like, douche, you hit the scoop and you're like, yes, okay, next phase. and he gives you that second to breathe and that's so satisfying hitting that scoop when you need to reward you to the next level and the way you do that on the pros you just hit the the center spinner shot which the center spinner shot's the easiest shot in the game so it's like you take a moment and you make it rewarding first just like yeah you just hit the you just hit the center spinner shot again so i do think i think it's an underrated mech i think it's it's utilized well and honestly, if I went from a premium to a pro, that would be the thing that I'd miss, in my opinion. I don't think I'd miss the dragon movement as much, but I do think I would miss the dungeon scoop. The dungeon scoop has been pretty cool. See, that's kind of curious because after playing it for a few, the mech I'm most impressed with is actually a cube. Sure. That thing's pretty cool. Yeah, the way the magnets work. I think it's... So I got to put a caveat on this because it can't... It's a fun game. Don't get me wrong, but I want to be transparent and be honest with people. If you haven't got a chance to play it yet. One of the things that I've had a tough time with is any ball that's coming around that right orbit. At least from my vantage point, I have a hard time picking up the ball in time for, you know, for the upper flipper shot. Yeah, it's yeah, because that that cube is so big, it covers it up. It's hard for me and I'm roughly six one. You're like an ogre. It's like eight and a half feet tall. So I imagine you have a difficult time. So you can't see it. Yeah. Yeah, it's tough. so but the mech itself though in terms of what it does it's interesting because you can you know you can hit the left orbit that turns to the left ramp you can hit it through that gelatinous cube it works its way around from the left ramp to the right side and then it catches on that magnet which that part's pretty cool like i mean it's just you know that's a basic pinball thing right the magnet catches what's really cool is is what happens afterwards to where you have options where you can either start that two ball multi-ball by hitting it back up the ramp again or you can lock it on the magnet down below, which I think it's actually, it's the same magnet, right? Same magnet, yeah. I forget, yeah. So you can lock it down below it on the right orbit, but you got to hit the right orbit shot to do that. And then what's really interesting is, I think it's, I'm pretty sure I'm getting this right. If you hit the right orbit again, that just gives you a three ball multi-ball. Whereas if you hit the left ramp again and you knock the ball off the top magnet, you get a four ball multi-ball. So that right there is kind of cool. Like, I like the idea of utilizing a mech or some type of magnet, whatever you want to call it, to be able to create these different stages of just risk reward, trying to get as much as many points or as many balls as possible into play as you want to do. So that in itself is I mean, I find that far more fascinating than anything else in the game. I've actually had a good time doing that. But the funny enough is I don't really do it that often when I'm actually playing through the game. but when it does happen, I mean, it's, it's a pretty cool moment. Well, the other thing though, is it's, is that magnet is a setup shot. And what I mean by that is if you hit the far left scoop FISMO shop, it will then eject the shot up past that flipper and the magnet is supposed to grab it. Is that a hundred percent? No, but it's, it's, it's a very consistent thing where it'll grab the ball. And then that it's basically you're feeding that upper flipper in a very consistent way. And so because of that, there's two upper flipper shots and a target. The left ramp is an upper flipper shot. There's an inner loop, which is an upper flipper shot. And then there's a dungeon target. But you can also, with that thing, on a premium RLE, you can hit the scoop, the dungeon scoop, if it pops up, and you can hit the captive ball, which is the critical hit target. So there's a lot you can do with that upper flipper. And the fact that you can stage that upper flipper in a consistent, repeatable way, really, there are some pinball machines where the upper flipper shots are really hard and you're rewarded for it when you hit it. But on this game, it's just another shot. I have zero complaints when the enemy is on an upper flipper shot because I know I can set it up in a reliable way so I can hit it. And that, I love that. There's something about hitting consistently and cleanly with an upper flipper. it's it's so much more satisfying so the left ramp from the upper flipper shot is is a very enjoyable shot so i i that was just one of those things until you play it that magnet really doesn't they've utilized that magnet so well with the layout i think doesn't the magnet catch too if you hit the shortcut 180 shot that's sometimes that's it yeah that's in between the spinner and the right ramp i'm pretty sure you can backhand that so the shortcut shot which is kind of like a horseshoe basically you can backhand that from the right ramp so it's one of those things where if an upper flipper shot's lit, you have the ability. It's like, well, do I want to hit FISMO shot to do it? Do I want to try to backhand it to hit the shortcut to feed it? Or do I want to be crazy and hit the left orbit with full speed to hit it? But you have three easy ways to get that ball in play. And comparing that to a lot of other games with an upper flipper shot where you may only have one way to get the ball in play, it's awesome. And this is a good question for you, Travis, I had a buddy shout out Derek. He asked me the question. He said, do you like D and D or shadow more? Because they're both Brian Eddie games. They both are his only three flipper layouts. So which one from a layout standpoint, and even if you want to bring in toys and mechs, which game do you like more? Shadow or D and D? I mean, honestly, I'd probably say shadow just because of the way that the ramps are, the furbos and all that. Furbos are awesome. Yeah, controlling that, going back and forth, upper play field is actually a fun upper play field to play because it's not necessarily your classic used flippers, right, or anything like that. I like doing loops on it. So, I mean, I'd probably have to go with Shadow, but that's not to say, oh, D&D, like, isn't fun. Like, to me, this is the best Brian Eddy layout that he's done at Stern. That's false. Like, I like it better than Stranger Things. I owned a Stranger Things for a while. I like it better than Venom, you know, and then Mandalorian. Had Mandalorian for a while. So I think that this one, for sure, it's just, it's one of those things that when you get a layout that's more dynamic than anything, that it has three flippers or more than three, as long as it doesn't feel convoluted to the point that it's just like you can't get anything done in the game, right? This feels like you can get through the game with the way the layout is. So I think that's where a lot of people are going to get attached to that or they're going to have more fun with it because of that. I completely agree, and there are plenty of games that I've played with a third flipper that that third flipper may have one shot. It's like all that, they put in that entire mech and then mess with that whole geometry to give you one shot with that upper flipper. And if it's a stern, sometimes that upper flipper is a stand-up target. Yeah, oh yeah, like Led Zeppelin. Yeah. So but yeah, I just think I really have enjoyed the layout. And to me, the shadow versus D&D question, it's hard to be. I love the metal snappy ramps that you get with the Furbos in shadow. I would love that type of diverter in a modern game because the speed at which you can switch things around is so cool. Yeah. But I would easily say I think I would put shadow and D&D as Brian Eddy's top two designs, in my opinion, when it comes to the layout. Yeah, Shadow just plays fast. Like, if you really want that pin to play fast, that can play fast. And you don't want this game to play fast. Right, D&D is not a fast-playing game. In my opinion, it's not. Now, you can turn it into that if you're going to be a savage and just go after the dragon the entire time. Yeah, you can make it play all kinds of crazy then. Let's also talk about the shield, because one thing that I didn't really start to utilize with the shield until it was here is not only is the shield great for protection, But the way it's designed, you can use it to set up two other shots rather reliably. You're supposed to be able to say, yeah, I will give the major caveat because I played on a couple of location games. It's very setup dependent. Yeah. And you might find like you'll have to change some stuff around. Maybe. It just depends because you might be able to hit the right ramp like I played on one to where it could not hit the right ramp no matter what. But it would hit the left orbit clean. That's where I am. Yeah. And then I've seen the opposite where the right ramp is clean. Left orbit is not. It's hitting off the standup targets instead. So that's where my, the game that I have, the way it's set up. So what we're saying is you pop the shield up and then you let the ball just rest. Yes. You hit the action button, the shield pops up and you let the ball just rest. And it's going to rest either because of the way it's shaped, either on the left side or the right side. So if it's resting on the right side, you can just let the ball sit there. And then when you flip with the right flipper, it on mine, it hits the left orbit every time guaranteed. And then if it's sitting on the left side of the shield and you flip with the left flipper, it might hit the upper right ramp. And what's weird is there was a period of time. There was two or three days where mine would do it rather consistently. It would hit the upper right ramp, which is to me the hardest shot in the game. That's the hardest shot for me to hit. So there were modes where it's like, that's the shot I need. It would be like, I almost want to build up shield not to protect myself just for the layup, the T-ball shot to hit that ramp. um and i just that's awesome like what a unique physical feature to aid in that and i i i neither of us really you realize that or or tried to start building that into our game plan when we're at the media day and i'm curious from a tournament standpoint if people you know depending on how the game's set up if people might utilize the shield to hit shots versus protect you know for safety i don't know yeah i mean i have lots of thoughts on that but you know i don't know how much time do we have to discuss that you know what i mean true true i think it's it's just it's very early to consider this game for tournaments and i mean it's obviously stern's going to have their launch parties either way so whether we like it or not this pin's going to get dragged into tournaments kicking and screaming whether it's ready or not so it'll be interesting to see I'm trying to figure out I have the launch party video ready to go Joel I kind of want to give you these I want to give you these strategies so you can try it because I think I can get you over 800 million I'm pretty sure 500 million actually it's Joel I can get you over 350 million Joel I can already get over 300 I think my high score is like 400 something oh yeah we'll get over that well but honestly though I have not I haven't prioritized a shot for points at all Like, right. This game, because you're not playing in tournaments or, you know, launch part. Yeah. It's, it goes both ways. There's other games though, where it's like, I don't know, most of the time in my head, if you can crack a billion on a stern, you've done something. So there are some times where I turn that on and I'm like, okay, I got a super jackpot shot or I have this or I have that. I just haven't even thought about the word jackpot or play field multiplier like this game. Yeah. The way my brain, and maybe we will just transition into this, but yeah, we can talk about. This game, I had Elizabeth Gieske on stream the other day, and she made a comment of like it really took. She's a tournament player, very skilled tournament player. Obviously, Gieske was involved in Jaws. She's been involved in some other games. She wrote almost every mode in D&D. And she said when she first got in it, she really had to change her mindset on this game because it's very clear. This is a passion project for Dwight that the goal of this game is an epic journey to to have very fun story based character experience, level up journey that you're going to work through, whether using pin save over time or just how far are you going to get in this journey in one game? And honestly, I think points tournament play. They put that on the back burner. That's on the it's in the game. It's pinball. We understand it. But the goal of this game is the journey. And for me, that's how I like playing pinball. So for me, I'm loving every second of it. For a player like you, I know this is a foreign language. This is like, how do I do this? How do I have fun? Yes and no. So it's one of those interesting things. When you look at, and I'm sure there's several people that listen to this podcast that have played at Stern Pro Circuit events, won them, played in world championships. like the reality is is that if you are if you consider yourself above average player you know you can put up a billion points on a stern whatever and you have a game at home there's two ways that you really approach it you're either going for score or you're going for a wizard mode and oftentimes depending on just how the software is and how the rules are you may not have to worry about score when going for a wizard mode it's more about progression anyways yep like completing something, starting something, doing something like that. So, I mean, I think if you're looking at this and you're realizing, okay, wait, they're prioritizing a story over points. I don't want that to dissuade the players that do focus on points and do play tournaments from not at least trying out this pin. Like there's still, you could still min-max your way to a billion, two, three billion points on this game There always a path And it just that path becomes even more apparent because the focus is more on story than points If your focus isn on points obviously there going to be a lot more imbalances up front that's going to be able to be exploited. That's, I mean, that's just what it is, right? It's just, that's just what happens. But from a narrative perspective, if you're looking towards just progression, getting through it, then yeah, this pen does cover that, right? Because there are rules, there are modes up front to go through the towns and keep trying to get to the end. And I think, what is it? They have one part of it so far that's done that you can get. So I think it's that, cause I saw this character for the first time yesterday. Somebody whipped, yes, somebody whipped out that character on me when I was like, Hey, let's play a game of D and D on location. They're just like, let me log in. I'm like, what is this character? I haven't seen them yet. Yeah. So I mean, yeah, obviously people are getting through it and people are trying out different things and i think that this is the type of game that because there's so many callouts and because it's story-based progression it lends itself to a lot more updates in the future that focuses that focuses on expansion right not not so much trying to fix like that a mode just needs to play different right yeah i mean there's always bugs and stuff like that but you get what i'm saying they're not gonna have to like change around entire modes just to fit something to make somebody happy it's more about expanding the universe is what it becomes so they're um just a brief overview um there's there's six well there's seven towns in the game but the center town doesn't doesn't have any unique modes they have some stuff dark hold yeah but the other six towns only four of them are unlocked at the beginning and um the bottom two towns only have one mode the middle two towns westgate and arabelle are the bottom two and then you got greenest yeah greenest and then cobalt town or those are the middle two and both of those have three modes each and then the top two are dragon nest dragon spear and uh i have no idea good luck saying that gaunt gaunt le grim gone grim yeah what's really cool though is so the first the bottom four cities are the only ones unlocked at the beginning and um so the idea is to play the dungeon within that city, you have to be at all the modes. So if you play either the bottom two, they only have one mode. So you have one mode, you beat it or lose. It doesn't matter. You beat it or lose. You're not going to lose because the way the game works is if you drain, you know, if you start a mode and you drain in ball two, you're still in that mode. In ball three, you're still in that mode. If you drain in ball three, I mean, the game's over. Now, if you're using pin save and you log back in, you can start that mode again. You can start. So it's hard to fail a mode. now once you beat all the modes you can play a dungeon dungeon's a different story dungeon you can absolutely fail a dungeon and the way that you fail a dungeon in this game is you lose your health you pass out you're knocked out so every character your entire party has hit points and it's basically time and so while you're playing the modes and you're being attacked you will lose hit points and so if you play it long enough you can get kicked out of the dungeon because you died.